Sandra Henderson 0:01
We’re back with another interview today and this one is full of the most amazing takeaways. My friend Rob from Square 8 Studio joined me to talk about senior photography and how you can utilize this market to gain clients as a wedding photographer. And when I say senior photography, I think that most people are automatically going to think of high school seniors, especially if you’re a US based photographer, because that is a huge market there. But we’re not talking about high school senior photography today! Rob has cornered the market in working with college seniors, especially those in fraternities and sororities. And by delivering an incredible client experience to these students during their senior sessions, he’s able to create return clients who in the not too distant future are going to be taking their own walk down the aisle. That, combined with his mindset around pricing, and his approach to creating a simple pricing structure, helps him book out his calendar year after year in both his portrait and wedding photography businesses. No matter where you’re located in the world. I know you’re gonna get so much out of this episode. So let’s just get right to it, shall we? You’re listening to Episode 26 of Keeping It Candid!
Sandra Henderson 1:09
(Intro music) Welcome to Keeping It Candid. I’m your host, Sandra Henderson, an international wedding and family photographer and business coach. I help wedding photographers use systems to build out the back end of their businesses to gain control and continue to thrive no matter what life throws their way. And on a more personal note, I’m a strong Enneagram three wing two who is obsessed with tacos, and my love for traveling combined with navigating chronic illness life are just two of the many things that drive my passion for all things systems, workflows, and beating burnout as a business owner. Join me every week for a candid behind the scenes look at what it’s really like working as a wedding photographer, where I’ll give you actionable steps to take your business to the next level. Absolutely no fluff here, friends. So go grab your favorite notebook and pen and let’s dive into this week’s episode. (Intro music fades out)
Sandra Henderson 1:57
Well, welcome, Rob, and thank you so much for joining me! I’m so excited to have you here today! Before we get started, if you could just take a quick second to introduce yourself and tell everybody a little bit about you.
Rob Greene 2:08
Yeah, thanks for having me! I am a photographer and educator based out of Fort Worth, Texas. So very opposite end of the accent spectrum from your neck of the woods, I would imagine. Hopefully I come through relatively neutral. But yeah, I have been doing this now for six going on seven years and have loved every bit of it. It’s been been a wild ride.
Sandra Henderson 2:33
It’s so funny that you bring that up about accents, because you and I first met at the Showit United Conference in November 2021. And so many people- I was like one of two or three Canadians, and there were so many people were like, ‘Wait, it doesn’t sound like you have an accent.’ But then I said the word ‘out’ and then all of a sudden, like I had people cheering for me. So yeah, it was so funny that you brought that up.
Rob Greene 2:54
Oh, yes, for sure.
Sandra Henderson 2:55
So I’m super excited to dive into this topic, because a lot of people as they’re building their businesses in the wedding photography industry, or just the photography industry in general, we hear a lot of people telling us that we need to niche down and we need to offer, you know, just one or two things. I don’t necessarily agree with that. I think that you know, as someone who primarily focuses on like weddings and families on my own website, I still get inquiries for all kinds of things from there. So I’m really excited to talk to you about how senior photography has impacted your business as a whole and how it’s impacted you as a wedding photographer as well.
Rob Greene 3:31
Yeah, well, and just to hit on what you’re talking about there with, like, niching down and, you know, do I focus on just one or two things? You know, I get inquiries for a lot of things, too. I only show the things on my site I want to book lots of, but I do think yeah, like, you know, in like this, we’re just talking about before I jumped on here how the, you know, I did a couple of headshot sessions this morning. I don’t advertise publicly that I do headshots, but you know you if opportunities for them to present themselves. I’ve got the stuff in place to do that for people. And I’ve built this quiet little side thing with that as well. But yeah, as far as seniors, I think it’s really important to distinguish because for most people when they think senior photography, they think high school seniors. And I have found that that for me is not where I want to be for a number of reasons, not the least of which is, you know, you have those like helicopter parents that want to jump in and control how the session goes and those sorts of things. And for somebody that started in wedding photography, I’m used to being able to work more directly with the client and have that kind of interaction. And so for me when I think of senior photography, I’m not thinking about high school seniors at all, I’m actually thinking about college grads, and that for us has been an unbelievable source of revenue and quite honestly just joy in running my business that has opened up a ton of doors for possibilities and become like the number one source of how we get our weddings as well, which has been really cool.
Sandra Henderson 5:05
Oh, that’s so awesome. And how has it been like it becomes your number one source is there like one or two specific things that make these ideal clients that transfer them over into weddings?
Rob Greene 5:16
Well, think of it like this. Imagine because you know, you said you do weddings and families imagine let’s start with the family aspect of this. Imagine your perfect family that you love working with. And imagine they lived in a massive neighborhood, full of only perfect families, for you that love your services, right. And they all and they all hang out at the pool on the weekends, or they all go out and eat dinner together. Like they’re always having parties at somebody’s house. Or take the wedding scenario. Imagine your perfect bride. And she lives in a neighborhood with all people that just got engaged in every year, a few people get married and move out of the neighborhood. But every year a few people move into the neighborhood. And they’re also like the perfect client for you. And they’re all telling everybody Oh, you got to shoot with Sandra. That’s what college is like. It is a demographic unlike any other because you have 1000s. And in some cases here in the States, 10s of 1000s of ideal clients that all live on a college campus, that’s just a few blocks, you know, in radius. So you’re talking about 1000s of ideal clients all living within a few blocks of each other, all hanging out in class, on the weekends, at games at parties going to dinner together. And they’re all when they get together, what are they doing, they’re talking about the things that they love. And all you have to do as a photographer, is build the kind of brand that people love. And they’re going to be talking about you when they go to all of these places. So for me, it’s been the most rich and like dense word of mouth market that I could have ever imagined. I’ve never seen anything like it in photography. And yet for so many photographers, they have no idea it even exists.
Sandra Henderson 6:59
Yeah, absolutely. That’s such a good point. I love how you brought up that like, these are all people that are regularly hanging out together going out for dinner and things like that. There’s that saying that like birds of a feather flock together. And I think it’s so true, you’re not very likely going to come across a group of 10 friends where every single one of those 10 people is completely different with absolutely nothing in common. Like they all enjoy watching the same shows and listening to the same music going to the same restaurant. So they will likely have the same tastes and ideas as they go into wedding planning as well.
Rob Greene 7:32
Well, and here, here’s another unique thing about this market Sandra that I think just really has made it a perfect fit for me with all the work we do with our weddings is when I think of high school seniors, I think of an individual. And I think of them and probably their mom coming on the session with them. And that’s pretty much it. You know, maybe you’ll have them like bring a friend that jumps in a picture to at the end. But with college, it’s all about friendships. It’s all about relationships. And so when I’m doing the senior sessions, yes, sometimes it’s just one person. But more often than not, who I’m photographing is a group of five or seven or 10. Or we actually just booked one for a group of 15 friends that I’m just like, man, bring it on. It’s so fun. Because then for me as a photographer, I don’t even have to worry about like, how do I make sure this is fun for them. They’re already hanging out with their, you know, 14 other best friends, they’re gonna have fun, all I have to do is just like ride the wave of energy that they bring to the session. But here’s what happened Sandra is they have an amazing time with me. They get back a bunch of photos with them, and they’re besties. And then a few months later, Jojo the boyfriend goes and puts a ring on it. And that all those besties that were in those pictures with them are now getting invites to become bridesmaids. And so this bride to be is sitting there thinking hmm, who should I reach out to about my wedding photography? And then they realize oh wait, here’s this guy Rob. He just took a bunch of pictures of me and all these girls that are gonna be my bridesmaids. We loved the way we looked in our photos. We love the way the photos turned out. We love how much fun we had with him. Why would I go searching for somebody else that I may or may not have that kind of connection with when this guy shoots weddings to and he’s made us look amazing. And so we wind up skipping the line it’s like a Fastpass at Disney or something you know we we just skip the line to of the inquiry process because we get these people that have already worked with us and already know us already. Trust us already love our work. And it just makes the whole experience so stinking rich.
Sandra Henderson 9:43
It’s like a total no brainer decision at that point. And it just makes I’m sure it takes a lot of the stress off their plate when they’re planning their wedding and just gets them often to just such like exciting foot because a lot of people that I connect with are like, you know, getting through that initial stages of the wedding Planning process can be really daunting and overwhelming. But when you already have that connection, it’s just kind of like a breath of fresh air as you keep going forward.
Rob Greene 10:07
100% I remember last year, there was this gal Sydney. She was one of my campus reps. So we also have this team of campus reps that are people on TCU campus. I’m near TCU. That’s the college here in Fort Worth, and which we just got to go to the playoffs for college football this year and we are stoked about it. I’m so pumped. Sidney was one of my campus reps her senior year. So we did a bunch of shoots together as a part of that. And then we did her senior photos with her best friends. Then we also she told her boyfriend Josiah, hey, you got to do your senior photos. So this guy so Josiah rounds up like 10 of his best buds. And we did all their senior photos. Well, all her girls were bridesmaids. Most of his guys were groomsmen. When we I shot their proposal, all their engagement photos show up at their wedding last December. And all the bridesmaids were people I’d photographed all the groomsmen or people I photographed half of the college aged wedding guests were people that I’d done their senior photos. It was the most fun I’d ever had shooting a wedding because you just felt like you were part of the family at that point. And there was so much trust built up. There was so much just like shared understanding of how this needed to go what needed to happen, that it made things a breeze like the least stressful wedding I’d ever photographed.
Sandra Henderson 11:25
Yeah, oh, I can imagine and that kind of thing… It makes the day really enjoyable for the couple and the experience enjoyable for them. But it really makes it enjoyable for us.
Rob Greene 11:34
Absolutely.
Sandra Henderson 11:36
When you get home from that wedding day, doesn’t matter if it was 10-12 hours. It’s feeling like you were working for a fraction of that time. So why do you think that this is such an untapped market when it comes to wedding photographers, using seniors and college students as a lead in to getting new inquiries,
Rob Greene 11:51
I think comes down to a couple of things, Sandra, I think number one, I think most people assume college students don’t have money and can’t afford photos. And so for photographers, so many of us were struggling with this idea of like trying to establish our value and establish that people should pay us what we’re worth, and we’re trying to raise those prices. And we’re feeling like, ah, you know, like, I feel bad. Even charging, what I’m charging now is supposed to go to this audience where you know, they’re eating ramen noodles for three meals a day or something, you know, and there’s just this assumption that college students don’t have money. But when you go and look, especially at schools that have Greek life, where people are used to paying dues for sororities, and they’re paying astronomical tuition to go to school, and they’re doing all these different things that have large expenses attached to it, really your expense for these memories is a drop in the bucket of all of their overall when you look at the scope of their college experience, it’s a small fraction of the overall expense that they incur along the way. Not only that, but you also have the ability to set up your pricing in a way that can make you both the most expensive and the least expensive photographer on campus, all at the same time. And so what I’ve been able to do is position ourselves to where we are, we make on average around $1,000 A session. So we’re doing 1012 $100 A session right now, for a one hour session. And yet, we are affordable for everybody because of how we’ve structured our pricing. And so it’s one of these things where, man again, once people hear about you and get on camp and your your name is on campus, if they know that their friends shot with you, they want to shoot with you too. And so it just makes it much easier to get into them people realize.
Sandra Henderson 13:37
Hey, friends, I’m interrupting this amazing interview for a quick second to let you know about a brand new freebie that I just released. If you want to give your wedding workflow, a refresh this year, or if you’ve never had a workflow at all, run, don’t walk over to my website, simplysandrayvonne.ca/freebies, and steal my wedding workflow. This is the exact 16 Step workflow that I use in my own wedding photography, business. And it’s ready to help you take your clients from the time they book with you right through until you’re finished your time together and are asking for reviews, all you need to do is input these steps into your favorite CRM system, add in your email templates, and voila, you’ve got a complete wedding workflow and can start delivering an incredible client experience while getting some of your freedom back at the same time, head to simplysandrayvonne.ca/freebies to get your copy.
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Sandra Henderson 13:37
Hey, friends, I’m interrupting this amazing interview for a quick second to let you know about a brand new freebie that I just released. If you want to give your wedding workflow a refresh this year, or if you’ve never had a workflow at all, run, don’t walk over to my website, simply Sandri vaughn.ca forward slash freebies and steal my wedding workflow. This is the exact 16 Step workflow that I use in my own wedding photography business. And it’s ready to help you take your clients from the time they book with you right through until you’re finished your time together and are asking for reviews. All you need to do is input these steps into your favorite CRM system, add in your email templates, and voila, you’ve got a complete wedding workflow and can start delivering an incredible client experience while getting some of your freedom back at the same time, head to simply Sandri vaughn.ca forward slash freebies to get your copy.
Rob Greene 14:31
That would lead me to the second thing is college and sorority photography. I think what holds people back from jumping into it is they don’t know how to start. And so what I have been able to do over these past couple years is take everything that I spent six years learning how to do with no roadmap and basically creating a roadmap for photographers on how to break into this market that nobody knows how to do Break into, because there’s a lot of people out there that will say, I wasn’t in a sorority, guess what me either. I’m a dude. You don’t have that, you know, we they do for attorneys, I don’t even do fraternities, I knew nothing about Greek life going in, I learned all this stuff as I went. But so I’ve been able to build a roadmap for people that we’re now seeing photographers at big schools, small schools, schools in the north, south, east, west, all over the country. I actually just had one sign up, that’s in Canada. So I’m excited to experiment with this. She’s over near Vancouver. So we’re going to be testing this out with her as well, in the coming weeks. But we’re seeing photographers around the United States experienced incredible success. They’re doing things in months, and sometimes weeks, that took me years to do, just because for the first time, there’s a roadmap on how to do it. That’s amazing.
Sandra Henderson 15:47
For everybody that’s listening, definitely make sure that you check it out. I have not checked out this specific course, or roadmap. But I have had the chance to see some of the work that Rob does with teaching flash and hear him speak at a conference as well. And your education is amazing. I love the way that you explain things. And the way that you break everything down makes it so easy to understand. And for someone who has been in the industry, like I’ve been using Flash for a good like 1415 years now. And I still learned, like so much just from the way that you phrase certain things that was like a light bulb went off in my brain that I was like, Oh, like that makes so much more sense to look at it that way. So yeah, everybody, make sure you run over to Rob’s website and check out some of his education offerings, especially if you are interested in diving into senior photography.
Rob Greene 16:31
Absolutely. Well, and we’ve got a thing coming up here in a couple of weeks, Sandra, where I’m actually gonna be doing a free five day mini course on college and sorority photography, that is- we call it College 101. And it’s going to walk you through all the basics to get on campus and get started booking your first sessions with college students. So if anybody’s interested in figuring out how the heck do I crack the code on this market, it sounds awesome. But I don’t know where to start. And I definitely wasn’t in Greek Life myself. It said You know, it sounds weird. Sounds scary. Let me help break that down for you the way we’ve broken down flasher, Sandra, and we’ll get you on campus and get you rolling with your business for the next year.
Sandra Henderson 17:11
I love that! I will definitely be signing up. I live in a what would be the equivalent of a college town in the US is where I live in Canada, we have a college and a university here and a couple other colleges like just outside the city. But we do have a lot of fraternities and sororities here, so I am definitely excited to check that out.
Rob Greene 17:31
You’re- you’re in a prime location, then, and I will keep you posted on how this goes with our friend in Vancouver as well to find out what we learned. Because I have a feeling this is gonna- I feel like there’s just there’s so much correlation geographically, even for our two countries that, you know, the similarities between college students I think around the world are largely similar, but especially US and Canada have a thin there’s going to be a ton of overlap and how those experiences go and what that can do for wedding photographers in the Canada area as well.
Sandra Henderson 18:00
Yeah, I agree, I definitely have had some reservations in terms of senior photography, when it comes to high schools, I think that that will be a lot larger of a task to break into with it not really being a thing that happens here. But I totally agree with you about the overlap between how colleges and universities work between the US and Canada. And I can definitely see how that can be really successful. So I hope that that goes really well for that photographer in Vancouver. And I’m definitely excited to see how that plays out. But that actually leads me into my next question is for any photographers who are living, whether it be in the US where they’re not, there’s not a huge market for senior campus photography or other countries where they may have different schooling systems. Do you have any tips for them about how they can tap into that kind of market without doing photos of seniors annually?
Rob Greene 18:51
Yeah, I think the biggest thing is to start tapping into any existing connections you might have, maybe you’re not on campus yourself. But if you have a friend who has a friend that goes to that college, or if you have a friend whose daughter goes to that college, or if you have a co worker who has a daughter that’s in a sorority at that college, or if you go to church with somebody who you know is going to that college, wherever you have, I have found that man, a little bit of generosity goes a long way and starting with one free session for that one person or that one person and therefore friends, because again, college is all about the friend groups. And so if you can, you know, insert that one strategic free session for a few friends, you’re going to wind up getting your your brand and your name inserted into that social pipeline, that rich social structure we talked about of just 1000s of students all living within a few blocks of each other. And I guess my other thing would be Yeah, come sign up for College 101. We’re going to be starting out here in a couple of weeks. And we’d love to have you in there because we’re going to unpack exactly how to do that how to make those ads asks, and how to several other avenues that you can pursue that will like showing up at tailgate parties before football games, and just walking up and taking pictures of photo, taking pictures of people and swapping Instagrams while you’re there. So many different strategies that you can use to just insert your name and your brand into the conversation. And once you’re in those conversations just spread like wildfire.
College 101 – CLICK HERE to get more info!
Sandra Henderson 20:25
Yeah, I can totally see how like, well, one can lead into the other and how beneficial this is going to be for wedding photographers. And earlier you mentioned that you position yourself in such a way that you are able to be the most expensive and least expensive photographer offering services on campus. I would love to know a little bit more about what that means.
Rob Greene 20:45
Yeah, great question Sandra. So I’m a big believer that your pricing needs to make sense to people. And one of the biggest mistakes I see photographers making when they book out portrait sessions is charging by the person. I think this is a huge mistake. Because most often we wind up spending the same amount of time shooting the session and delivering a very similarly sized gallery if not a little smaller, because a lot of us get nervous working with larger groups. And yet for each individual buying in, they’re getting fewer photos of themselves that feature them. And so I don’t believe it makes sense to the average client to have to pay just as much for the session if there are more people involved. And so and we teach this in the college and sorority course, but we I’m a huge believer in pricing in blocks of time, because I think everybody understands that your time has value. And so because we price by the hour, I’m able to say hey, when somebody comes to me and says, Hey, I would love to work with you. But do you have anything less expensive, I say, absolutely bring a friend with you. And you’ll both pay half as much. It’s still an hour of my time, I’m still doing the same amount of shooting editing. But for these two friends, they have now been able to cut their costs in half. But they’ve also been able to have a better experience because they got to do this with somebody, it’s it can be so awkward when you’re not used to taking photos. And now you’re one on one with this photographer, you’ve maybe met him once or twice. And now you’re having to stand and pose and do all these things like what do I do with my hands? Well, once you have your best friend there by your side, you’re laughing, having fun, you’re enjoying them, you’re thinking about them not thinking about what do I do with my hands. So I’m able to create a better experience for these friend groups. And they’re able to spend less per person on the session because we charge by the hour and not by the person.
Sandra Henderson 22:42
I love that perspective, I totally agree with you. I know there are lots of photographers who are, using the family portraits as an example, where we get a lot of times extended family sessions where three, four family units are all coming together. And a lot of photographers will charge a premium or add ons per family. But I totally agree with you, you can still essentially get the same number of photos done in that hour. But each individual family is going to be getting less photos of themselves, because you’re adding in those large family photos as well, and photos of just the kids and things like that. So that’s such a great perspective for portrait sessions across the board.
Rob Greene 23:19
And I find those families thinking about the extended family think those families tend to wind up all buying prints at the end there, you’re going to be making more naturally on those sessions. And yet they’re going to understand it. What I would say to those people is like if that’s you, if you’re that extended family photographer, and you’re you’re wrestling with like, oh, but how can I make that switch? People understand that it takes more time to shoot more families. So add on time? Well, we have we have college students to do it all the time with us. They’re like, hey, we have a larger friend group. Can we add more session time? Absolutely. Here’s what that cost. Now, that’s an easy decision for them, because they understand more of my time is more valuable to me, and therefore they would spend extra for that that makes perfect sense to them to do that with.
Sandra Henderson 24:02
Yeah, absolutely. And making things as easy as possible for the clients to understand means that it makes it easier for us to get paid. And that is ultimately like an end goal that I think everybody should make a priority
Rob Greene 24:14
100%. I am a big believer in a no brainer booking process. The less brain cells people have to burn through, you know, trying to think through how do I get this thing booked and get my date picked and get my money put down? The less they have to think about that. And the easier we can make for him. That’s just an extra way to serve them before they’ve even officially become a client just by making this easy for them.
Sandra Henderson 24:35
Yeah, absolutely. Before we wrap things up, this has been the most amazing conversation. Do you have any final takeaways that you hope that wedding photographers or campus photographers take from this episode or anything that they can apply to their businesses going forward?
Rob Greene 24:50
Yeah, I would say if you think college photography as a wedding photographer is going to be just like high school photography. You are sorely mistaken they couldn’t. College photography has so much more in common with what you do as a wedding photographer than it has with high school photography. So do yourself a favor do your business a favor if you like working with clients who already love you already trust you already are obsessed with your work before they even reach out to you. If that’s the kind of client you look forward to having inquire about you shooting their wedding, college and sorority photography is where you need to be spending some time in this coming year, not building out Google ads and paying for Google ads and Facebook ads. Go get connected on your local college campus because it is going to become the best source of weddings for you this coming year.
Sandra Henderson 25:41
And who doesn’t love clients like that? And wedding days like that? Really?
Rob Greene 25:44
Right? That’s what I’m saying. They’re just the best!
Sandra Henderson 25:49
Where can everybody find you online if they want to check in with your courses or just follow you on social media and things like that?
Rob Greene 25:56
Yeah, great question. I have a few different places number one, jump on Instagram. That’s the main like social media place to find me. You’ll find me at @square8studio. And then I also have a podcast, The BOP, that I do. So it’s a fun actually to be on a this end of the conversation Sandra, I’m really enjoying this aspect of it a lot. But I do monthly episodes with people around the photography industry. And then I also have an education page square8studio.com/education where you’ll find all of our courses and free classes, like that College 101 that’s coming up here in a couple weeks.
Sandra Henderson 26:36
Amazing! Well, thank you so much again for joining me. It was really great talking to you! I loved this conversation, and I hope that our paths crossed again soon!
Rob Greene 26:45
Absolutely. Let’s make it happen!
Sandra Henderson 26:47
(Outro Music) Thank you so much for listening. You can find full show notes from today’s episode at simplysandrayvonne.ca/keepingitcandid in the meantime, let’s connect. You can find me on Instagram and Tiktok just search @simplysandrayvonne. And if you’re loving this podcast, I’d be so honored if you’d go ahead and hit that subscribe button and leave a review. Until next time! (Music fades out)
About Rob
Rob Greene is the owner of Square 8 Studio, a photography and education brand based out of Fort Worth, Texas. Through both his online courses and his podcast, The BOP, Rob and his mini Goldendoodle, Snoopy, are on a mission to help photographers build their business, wow their clients, and make photo magic. Rob is a firm believer that you’re always ahead of someone and always behind someone, therefore you should always be teaching and always be learning. When he’s not taking photos or teaching photographers, you’ll find Rob obsessing over his latest Apple devices, or watching his favorite soccer team, Atlanta United.
Sandra Henderson 0:00
If you’ve been a wedding photographer for any length of time, I can almost guarantee you you’ve heard someone talk about figuring out your why. The reason why you’re a wedding photographer and why you started this business on this career path to begin with. I’ve even talked about it more than a few times on the podcast. It’s so important for so many reasons. And I talked about all of them and more with Jasmin from JC Photography, who was our guest on today’s episode, she and I chatted about how your why can help you do things like set boundaries, how it coincides with your values as a business owner, and how becoming a mom shaped Jasmin’s perspective about the mark she wants to leave on the world.
Sandra Henderson 0:39
You’re listening to Episode 25 of keeping it candid.
Sandra Henderson 0:43
(Intro Music) Welcome to Keeping It Candid. I’m your host, Sandra Henderson, an international wedding and family photographer and business coach. I help wedding photographers use systems to build out the back end of their businesses to gain control and continue to thrive no matter what life throws their way. And on a more personal note, I’m a strong Enneagram three weighing two who’s obsessed with tacos and my love for traveling combined with navigating chronic illness life are just two of the many things that drive my passion for all things systems, workflows, and beating burnout as a business owner. Join me every week for a candid behind the scenes look at what it’s really like working as a wedding photographer, where I’ll give you actionable steps to take your business to the next level. Absolutely no fluff here friends. So go grab your favorite notebook and pen and let’s dive into this week’s episode. (Music fades out)
Sandra Henderson 1:31
I am so excited to have you here! For everybody who is listening, they’re not going to know but we tried to do this interview once before, and then after my internet cut out on Jasmin three times I decided it was probably best to reschedule it so I could be more respectful of her time. So thank you so much for bearing with me, Jasmin, and I’m so excited to finally have you here for an interview.
Jasmin Blais 1:51
Yeah, me too. I’m so excited. I’m ready. I’m ready for it.
Sandra Henderson 1:55
Good. Oh, I’m so glad. And thank you for being the first official Canadian guests that we’ve had. I do have a local vendor series that by the time this episode comes out, local vendor series will have been out but this is my first official like non London Ontario interview with another Canadian. So super excited.
Jasmin Blais 2:14
Yeah, I’m so excited.
Sandra Henderson 2:16
Okay, well, before we dive in and start chatting, I would love it. If you could just take a second to let everybody know who you are what you do and something about you.
Jasmin Blais 2:25
Yeah, sure. So I’m based in Saskatchewan, Canada, Prince Albert, if anybody knows who that is, but yeah, I started photography back in 2012. And kind of really dove into it. And 2014 I primarily do wedding photography, as well as for education, and mentor other photographers. I’m a teacher by trade. So just Yeah, I just love it. And I really love the community, your competition. I really love connection and helping other people. And yeah, that’s kind of kind of the gist of me and why I’m so excited to be on your podcast today.
Sandra Henderson 3:08
I love that. Well, we started our businesses roughly around the same time. So I launched in 2013. And so I’m curious with having a love for our community over competition and just believing in that mindset, which I do as well. Don’t you find that things are so different now in that aspect than they were back when we were first starting out?
Jasmin Blais 3:28
Yeah, like and I think, yeah. Like, from my experience was, there wasn’t any community, like, you know, right. And it was a lot of trial and error. And I do think back to the time, I’m like, Okay, well, the benefit of that was it put me in situations where I really, really had to dig. And I really, really had to make some mistakes to learn. And that was great. I did eventually have a really great mentor, she was amazing. And we’re friends, dear friends today, but that kind of drove me into, into flipping that, you know, flipping that script and just kind of being like, why why is there such a scarcity mindset? You know, like, what, why are people so afraid to, to share what they do? You know, like, we’re gonna deliver a different experience because we’re two different people. So you know, why, why is sharing where the location that I shoot, or the preset that I use gonna make any difference to, to my services or losing any services? Right. I think there’s a client. There’s clients out there for everybody. And I think just changing that mindset is going to make everybody’s photography journey so much better.
Sandra Henderson 4:46
I could not agree more. You took those words right out of my head. I totally agree with you in every aspect. It’s not taking away from you at all to help other people out at the end of the day. What is going to set us apart is who we are and the service that we offer, not the photos that we’re creating. So I’m totally not all about keeping things secret. Like, if you want to know where I took this photo, then I’m going to tell you and go have fun. I can’t wait to see what what you do when you get there. Yeah, and
Jasmin Blais 5:14
I also believe it’s like, good karma. You know, like, I feel like, I feel like if you’re gonna withhold anything, and you know what, and to be fair, I used to be like that, because I was afraid of, of losing clients and stuff like that, for sure.
Sandra Henderson 5:27
And it’s all that we knew.
Jasmin Blais 5:29
Yeah. And it kind of, to say that I always was in this community mindset is not true. It just, it came, it came to a point where it was like, this is like, it’s silly to not share and stuff. And I think being a teacher, you know, for for like, seven years. It’s, that’s what we did. And that’s, that’s how we grew. And so I think it was just natural for me to kind of dive into that, you know, way of doing things in photography.
Sandra Henderson 5:59
Yeah, absolutely. Well, speaking of how things that happen in your personal life, have shaped who you are as a business owner, and as a photographer, how did becoming a mom change your mindset as a business owner?
Jasmin Blais 6:11
Yeah, it’s, it’s funny, for me anyways, when I had when I had children that I got under this, I became very, I don’t wanna say emotional, but I’m kind of like, for it. And not not just like, obviously, you know, the postpartum and everything from it, but just kind of my journey with it, and just kind of being like, what kind of world do I want my kids to grow up in? What kind of things do I want to model to my children, just to see them that, you know, trying and failing, and, and learning and treating others with respect that, you know, that’s important. And I felt like I, you know, I need to completely practice what I preach and really, you know, put that forth within my business and within my life. And that, I think, is probably the biggest thing that changed since I have had kids and also setting boundaries. That was one of the biggest things time was a big thing. You know, it passes so quickly, even though some days feel like years, but it passes so quickly. And I just wanted to make sure that where I was putting my time was where I felt, I could be away from my kids and not feel guilty about it, you know. So there were certain things I let go of, that I just felt didn’t really serve my time anymore. And then there was things that I just really, really took on, like wedding photography, I just really felt like, I loved that energy. And I loved being around it. And that was worth, you know, being away from my kids. Not all the time. But when I when I booked wedding, I felt okay about it.
Sandra Henderson 7:45
Yeah, absolutely. And I’m sure making those changes helped to your mindset and the time that you were taking to spend with your kids as well. I know from my side of things, I sometimes feel guilt in both directions. If I’m spending too much time working and overworking myself not sticking with those boundaries, I feel guilty for what it’s taking away from my family. And then if I am taking, you know, an extra few days off, taking a vacation taking a week off, then I start to feel guilty about it taking away from my business. So I’m sure that making those adjustments and feeling really happy and confident about the work that you were booking just left you in a mentally better place during that time that you were with your family.
Jasmin Blais 8:26
Yeah, totally. And it kind of makes you a little bit more present, you know, appreciating those moments that you do have with him. And you know, running a business is kind of one of those tricky things where setting boundaries, this is a big thing. I’m not an expert it by any means. But knowing you know, when when’s a good time to put that away, you know, doing things like putting time limits on your phone, and you know, just things like that not not having notifications pop up, unless you actually go physically into that app and, and check it out or whatever, you know, things like that. And one thing, one thing that I really think Sandra that is really important, whether you have kids or not is figuring out your values and understanding your why. And that is just one of the things that I recommend, honestly, and whether you run a business or you know, you set a goal or anything, I mean, everybody set sets goals, and I think understanding why you’re doing something, and the values that are behind it are really going to help you stay focused when you know obstacles come your way because it’s inevitable, like and I think, you know if there’s anybody that’s starting wedding photography, or maybe maybe early 20s, or just graduated or whatnot, you know, and they’re just diving into all those great and crazy life experiences, that there will be obstacles, whether that’s big or small, every single day you will have an obstacle you will have I don’t like to say to failures, but I’ll just say it for the lack of just kind of making not dragging this on again. But there will be times where you feel like you failed. And you need to have a reason why that you’re gonna keep going. You know, and that’s the first thing I think that everybody absolutely needs to do. Because it’s times are gonna get tough. And you got to figure out why why you need to keep going.
Sandra Henderson 10:19
Yeah, for sure that is so so important. I know I went through is such a huge part of my business where I didn’t really have a why it was just like, I always love photography. And I knew I wanted to start a business. But taking the time to just really like go back to the very beginning, no matter how long you’ve been in business for, I think it’s good to revisit. But just going back to like the very beginning, the very, like, base bricks that you’ve put together to build up your business, and just figure out why you’re doing this, why they’re there, what is driving you to keep going because like you said, that’s going to be what keeps you going during those times that are hard. And it’s inevitable, just like regular life running a business is the same way there are going to be days that are absolutely amazing. And then there are also going to be days that you will question Why the hell am I doing this? And so yeah, getting that mindset. And that mindset based around your Y is a game changer for sure.
Jasmin Blais 11:13
Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I think, and it’s okay, if that wide changes, and it’s okay, if your value changes, you know, my values now aren’t the same that they were 10 years ago, you know, and that’s good. And I think that’s great, because that shows growth, you know, and I think it starts with like self awareness and getting to understand yourself. And, and I actually did this activity recently, where you ask yourself kind of like, first date questions, and you just kind of just just kind of like, understand yourself more, and then you look back at them, and you’re like, oh, yeah, like, you know, that is my favorite color. Or, you know, I am a morning person, I’m not a night person. And, and it’s just funny, because it’s just, you know, for me, like I’ve been married to my husband, or sorry, we’ve been together since we’ve been 18. And I’m, I’m 32. And so like, the idea of first dates is just for me. So asking myself all these questions was just very interesting. And I think once you understand yourself, you’re able to identify those values. And you’re able to understand where your Y is coming from, and digging deeper into what your y is not just the surface. And that is one of the biggest things. In any season of life, I would recommend whether you have kids or not. So
Sandra Henderson 12:27
I am a huge like, lover of all things self discovery, I like know my Enneagram I know my Myers Briggs and like all the things and so I really totally agree with you that there’s so much value in self discovery, I love the idea of asking yourself first aid questions, my husband and I have been together for like 15 years, we did not have a first date either. So it totally seems foreign to me too. But just like that level of self discovery, it really opens up so much when you’re just trying to get through day to day as a business owner. And another thing that you said that really jumped out at me when it comes to boundaries, and like you were saying, like when you’re 20, your priorities are different. And that’s totally fine. Your values are going to change as you get older, they could change year by year, it could be you know, 10 years from now, but it’s going to happen as you get older, and setting those boundaries. And doing that self discovery helps you kind of differentiate what matters to you during those really busy seasons. And those really slow seasons and being able to embrace what both of those bring to the table so that you can adjust your boundaries a little bit more like you and I being in Canada, we have our spring and the summer are super busy and follows super busy. And then it’s really quiet over the winter. And so we have to, to a certain extent embrace the busyness that comes along with those periods, and kind of adjust our boundaries to accommodate that because, you know, we have to bring in a little bit more income during those seasons in comparison to a photographer who has beautiful weather 365 days a year. So yeah, that really stuck out to me as you were talking as well.
Jasmin Blais 14:01
Yeah, totally. It needs funding because I still like I get super restless during slow season. And I guess like just looking at, you know, first Why are you you know, where is this restless coming restlessness coming from. And that usually stems from something from, you know, childhood or whatever, whatever you remodeled, things like that, you know, and then from there, just understanding your season of life and, and understanding that there’s other ways to feel that you can contribute that’s not financial, and look at it as a time to learn a time to, you know, expand like a like invest in education. And I think that’s a huge, huge thing. Like there’s a lot of free educational there, which is wonderful. And there is there is a lot of wonderful coaches out there that you can invest into, you know, in this time to to, to really take advantage of of the of the time that you have and I think If that’s what people find hard is restless. I know for me, like, when slow season hits right now, it’s you Yeah, you feel like, okay, I need, I’m losing kind of the sense of purpose a little bit because I’m not as busy as I was, or I don’t feel like I’m a you know, as needed, but then, you know, rewiring that to mean like, how can I improve? Or how can I grow? How can I help others? How could not, you know, and, and I think, again, going back to that, why and those values, and it’s really going to make a big difference for you to just focus.
Sandra Henderson 15:37
Yeah, absolutely. And you were saying, losing that sense of purpose. I think so many, if not all, wedding photographers struggled with that over the last couple of years, especially in 2020, when weddings just couldn’t legally happen. And we were dealing with so much. So many photographers kind of had to take a step back. And they realize how much of their self worth was based out of like, what they were putting out in their business. And I totally get it, we’re so emotionally connected to the art and the work that we’re creating, we build these relationships with our clients. So it’s totally valid. But there’s definitely what you also mentioned, like part of it from childhood and in the society that we grew up in, where we were led to believe that our value was based on the contribution that we were making. So I think it’s so important to like, again, going back to that, why figuring out why you’re doing this so that you can make those differentiations throughout your life in those times that you’re not able to be at the camera as much as you want to and things like that.
Jasmin Blais 16:35
Yeah, totally. Totally. And yeah, like I like my anagram is three with it. So the achiever with a wing of a helper-
Sandra Henderson 16:45
three wing two – me, too!
Jasmin Blais 16:47
Is it really?! funny, right? This is what like, kind of photographers are like, you know, and it’s funny, because one of the things on there as one of your biggest fears is disappointing people. And so if you feel like, you know, you’re not in that, you know, quote, unquote, you’re getting that praise, right or not to praise but you know, that feedback of not, Oh, I love my photos, or you were like, so great to work with, or, you know, whatever, you Yeah, you you kind of even subconsciously lose a sense of purpose. And so, I think that you just really need to kind of dig deep into where that all is coming from in and understanding that, like, all your emotions are valid, and that’s okay, like, you know, emotions come from thoughts and situations that happen. And so just kind of digging into why why you’re having these, these kind of thoughts that kind of maybe come out of nowhere, and identifying them and naming them and, and just just embracing the season of slow I think that our society is so go go go that just just be a little bit more present. And it’s gonna make, it’s gonna make slow season a lot better.
Sandra Henderson 17:58
For sure. I was talking to a friend of mine last year, and she actually shared with me something that her therapist told her and that was that your feelings are valid, no matter what it is that you’re going through. But the important thing is to like, just stop there for a quick vacation. Acknowledge how you’re feeling, validate how you’re feeling, but don’t unpack your suitcase there, because you’re not staying there. It’s time to move on afterwards and keep focusing on things that are a little bit more uplifting and fulfilling your soul a little bit more, but still giving yourself the respect to acknowledge those hard times that you’re going through.
Jasmin Blais 18:32
Yeah, exactly. And I think that comes to self awareness. Like what brings you joy, what drains you, you know, if we’re going to talk about you know, photography, for me, cake smashes, drain the living crap out of me, because I don’t, I don’t like doing them. I will do them for like my family. Because it’s family and I love them so dearly. And not to say I don’t love my clients, but it’s just, it’s just something that just takes away so much energy from me. So that’s something I let go. You know, it doesn’t give me energy boudoir photography. I love it so much. But it’s just something that I just don’t feel like I have the time to do to give it justice, what it deserves. And there’s so many other photographers out there that do such a wonderful job and have the energy for it. That it’s just like, I think that’s great for you. It’s just something that I just feel like I don’t have the energy to give for it, you know? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Like I think just figuring out what drains you what gives you energy and going towards what gives you energy of course, you know, and, I mean, we only have so much to spare and you know, if we have to take care of ourselves plus other people, it’s like, why are you going to do things that drain you or you feel like you’re supposed to do you know, for, you know, even things like outsourcing for photography, if you feel like you know, you have this giant editing, hell and you just get so overwhelmed. You just kind of put your head under your covers and just hope that it solves itself. Um, but you know, why don’t you outsource it? You know, why don’t you spend a couple $100 to somebody that actually wants to do it and, and then you gain more time and, you know, just things like that, again, I think that it goes to the scarcity mindset of not having, you know, money to do it or not having, you know, yeah, basically the finances to do things like that. But it’s like, you know what, but you’re, but you’re given more time, you know, like, time doesn’t change, you always have the same 24 hours in a day, Money comes and goes. And it’s just it ebbs and flows. And that’s just what it is. And, you know, and so why don’t you give yourself more time to do the things that you love?
Sandra Henderson 20:39
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Sandra Henderson 21:32
And you were saying earlier about like, wanting to know confidently that when you you’re booking a wedding, and you’re really excited to be going and it’s worth the time that you’re taking away from your kids, when you’re doing sessions that you don’t love and that you are not able to put your heart into you’re not serving your clients, but you’re also not serving your family or yourself and you end up with so much more guilt for the time that you’re spending away instead.
Jasmin Blais 21:56
Yeah, totally. Like, you know, just the amount of time of booking, shooting, delivering, you know, a session that really doesn’t serve you it’s it just takes away from why you started in the first place. You know, and, and I think when you are starting yours, you’re just kind of figuring out what you like to do. And for me, like, oh my gosh, like Sandra, I the things that I shot i i shot everything from livestock to do newborn to style newborn I do new remember lifestyle, yeah, to to, you know, product, to branding, to do anything, anything and everything. And I think that part was good, because I figured out like what I like what I don’t like, but it’s just it’s funny. It’s funny when I think back to actually to watch everything that I shot like, like I edited cows before. Like, it’s funny. Like, it’s funny to me, like just thinking about that. But I know that I that’s not what I want to do. And because I experienced it, so
Sandra Henderson 22:59
yeah, absolutely. There’s definitely value in trying a little bit of everything to see what you love and what you don’t love. When I first started out, I worked with a photographer while I was still in college, doing some Co Op hours with her. She was a newborn photographer. And I was like, I love this, this is totally what I’m going to be doing. No, that’s no longer a service that I offer. It was very similar to what you were saying with boudoir photos. I did love doing them. I loved the memories that I was capturing. Sometimes it wasn’t worth the stress of dealing with a newborn baby. But overall, it ended up just being that I didn’t have the capacity to pour into newborn photography in the same way that I was doing with families and weddings and things like that. And so the sessions weren’t really serving me. But they also weren’t serving my clients because I didn’t feel like I was giving them my best. And I don’t know about you, but when it’s a session that I didn’t love, editing becomes infinitely harder.
Jasmin Blais 23:59
Yeah, totally. And then in you kind of just have this idea of like, I just want to get done, send it off and never think about it again.
Sandra Henderson 24:06
Yeah, exactly. And I want to be excited to send off the gallery.
Jasmin Blais 24:09
Yeah, totally. And one thing that I want to revisit that you had said just about, just about oh my god, I’m having a brain fart now of paraphrasing what you said, but basically serving your client and I think that’s what we need to set. Yes, we have as business owners, we have our boundaries, and we have our values and everything like that. When it comes to client experience. We need to understand that like it is about our client, you know, you’re you’re solving your client’s problems, you’re being their highest person, you’re you’re there, you’re excited. I see sometimes too, that people are sometimes photographers and I’m guilty of it to kind of dig for red flags or they dig for you know, this person doesn’t appreciate me or this person did it and I think he just Gotta like step back and look at it from their perspective of, you know, they’ve never done photos before, or maybe they had a bad experience, or they’re making assumptions. Because they just don’t know, you know, it’s your job to educate it’s your job to, to solve the problems. And maybe at the end of the day, after you did all that, they just aren’t that great fit. And that’s okay. But yeah, it’s really about serving your client. And that’s why it’s important to shoot things that you love, because you know, you’re just naturally excited about it.
Sandra Henderson 25:31
Yeah, absolutely. And those boundaries really do come first come full circle. Because, like, I have pretty strict boundaries around my inbox, I don’t tend to unless it’s like an absolute emergency, I won’t reply to an email after seven, because my brain goes to mush, I’ll probably call you the wrong name. Like I do all these crazy things. After seven o’clock, I should not be replying to emails that late. And so because I do that, yes, I’m not available to my clients. 24/7, which I don’t think any business owner should be. But I’m then able to make up for it in a way by being a better version of myself and serving my clients in a better capacity because of those boundaries.
Jasmin Blais 26:14
Yeah, totally. Like, I totally agree, like my phone, you know, starts going into sleep mode at 930. And it is hard because, again, like as a business owner, and and for now, today’s day and age, like everything is so accessible, that, you know, you feel like if you’re not available in 20 minutes, after they send you a message, you’re going to disappoint them or, you know, whatever, but I think, you know, yeah, just, again, those boundaries are just so important to put up. And, and I think with kids, it actually is a little, you know, maybe a little bit easier. Because, you know, you just sometimes you’re forced not even to look at your phone, because you’re so busy, you know, trying to raise little humans, I just, you know, really, really urge, especially for people that maybe have a little bit more time to themselves, maybe they don’t have kids, maybe they’re not at that season yet, you know, to set those boundaries, because like it can get blurred, so easy. And then that leads to burnout. You know, and that’s never fun.
Sandra Henderson 27:23
Yeah, it’s so true. So for any listeners who are wanting to get started in implementing boundaries and getting a healthier mindset around running their business, do you have any, like tips or tricks that they can implement as they’re heading into 2023?
Jasmin Blais 27:35
Yeah, I love that. And like, what a perfect time to have this question. So the first thing that I would say, is when you’re setting your goals, and I think it’s super important to set goals in your business, you can set 12 month goals, I would chunk it down to 90 day goals after that. Because otherwise, it’s just, it’s super overwhelming. Set some big goals don’t minimize something you know, you’re capable of achieving, You’re just afraid to write it down. So we’re setting those goals, again, revisiting your values, revisiting your why’s, and just kind of writing those down making those visible, whether that’s like a wallpaper on your phone, or that is, you know, on a whiteboard, in your office, wherever. So somewhere where you can kind of just be reminded of it every day. Mindset is, yeah, it’s one of the biggest things because the biggest obstacle that you will ever face is yourself. And that is because you know, you’re going to you’re going to come up in situations, whether that’s business related or personal, or, you know, whatnot, where you you can’t control the situation, but you can control how you react to it. And really, really working on yourself and giving yourself grace and understanding that when obstacles come up, because they will ask yourself, what did I learn from this in any situation positive or not, you can always ask yourself that question. And it’s really, really going to make a huge difference for you in your growth. And this is something I wish that I did in my early 20s. You know, I always think, you know, what if I had this mindset, my early 20s than I feel like Where would my business be today, you know, if I just took risks, like I wanted to, and you know, stuff like that, but I also feel like it led up to this point to where I am today. And I’m really proud of of where I am and the work that I do and an understanding that like, hey, life will happen. Everything is not going to be happy all the time. And I’m going to have to deal with it and that’s okay. So those are like the biggest tips for mindset and then off I’m answering your question.
Sandra Henderson 29:50
Oh, totally. That was amazing. That was like total gold. I was even sitting here like jotting a few things down as the listener, just getting like a sneak preview at the episode as it was happening. Yeah, no, that was absolutely amazing. I especially loved how you said the biggest obstacle that you’ll ever face is yourself. Because Wow, so, so true. There’s so many times I have a business coach, and there’s been a few times this year she’s like, okay, so like, what is the actual problem? And I was like me, like, it’s literally just me. There’s no other obstacle in my way other than myself at this point. So yeah, I think a lot of people are gonna resonate with that.
Jasmin Blais 30:23
Yeah. On the business coach side, I was, kind of like a little bit of a left turn here. But don’t you think that having a business coach is amazing?
Sandra Henderson 30:32
Oh, my gosh, like absolute game changer! Yeah, I joined a mastermind and started working with my business coach at the beginning of 2021. And I’ve told her that she stuck with me for life, like, I don’t know. And so many people in the mastermind as well are like, it’s scary out there. The idea of going through this alone and not having a coach and other people who just understand it’s terrifying.
Jasmin Blais 30:55
Yeah, absolutely. And I think that is one of the biggest things of community and, and again, it’s that investment that people are afraid of, like, why do I need a business coach, like, that’s not going to teach me anything about taking a pretty picture. It’s just like, that’s, you know, taking beautiful photos, or you know, that’s your storefront. Everything else behind there is what that business coach is for, and you need you need in order to have something sustainable. You need to have somebody that understands what they’re doing. And yeah, so that was, that was like a little, that’s a little side thing that I you know, I always I always love to ask people that have business coaches, I’m like, Isn’t it the best? Like,
Sandra Henderson 31:33
yeah, oh, absolutely. And I think that when it comes to learning, the more creative aspects of photography, like we can all learn how to take better photos, but we became photographers, because there’s something in us that is an inherent ability to take photos. But like, more often than not, we were not also born with that inherent ability to run the business. Some people can do both. But like, for me, the learning aspect has come how to learn how to take better photos, and learn how to run a business.
Jasmin Blais 32:07
Yeah, totally, totally nuts when it comes to that outsourcing piece, right. It’s like, I don’t want to get so bogged down with trying to understand the business part of it, that I would rather have a coach that helps me out with it. So then I don’t need to spread myself so thin in trying to understand both aspects, you know, where, when everybody else just sees the the beautiful photo part of my business. And that is, you know, what, again, you know, brings in an audience and your ideal clients and things like that. And that’s something that I love doing that, you know, one of the big reasons why I got into this not to understand taxes, and bla bla bla, so I’d rather like, you know, have somebody help me with that. So
Sandra Henderson 32:46
yeah, absolutely. Well, speaking of making investments in your business, I know that you at the time of recording this anyway, have just recently released a course. And I would love for you to share with listeners a little bit more about that. Yeah, I’m
Jasmin Blais 33:01
so excited. So yeah, thanks for letting me share about it. This course is called Keeping wedding photography, simple how to book shoot and deliver weddings, it’s the course that I wish that I had, when I started digging into wedding photography, it really simplifies it, like how to get your clients, you know, gear to have a wedding day, problems that you’ll be solving how to location scout, things like that. It’s it’s all based on my experience of shooting weddings since 2014. And just simplifying something that is labeled as, you know, one of the big beasts of the photography, business as wedding, you know, wedding photography, and I just, I really wanted to create a course that was that wasn’t, you know, a 20 hour course because I think that, you know, nobody has time for that. I wanted something that was easy to follow. I wanted some tangible things to take out of that. So there’s a PDF with that with email templates and timelines and stuff like that. I really wanted to to make it as accessible to people. So it is, you know, it’s a digital online course. And yeah, it’s 90 minutes, six modules. It’s super easy to follow. It’s just something that I wish that I had when I started because everything, you know, if somebody told me something was great for wedding photography, I wouldn’t have bought it, you know, or if somebody said, you know, you know, I tried this, okay, I’m gonna try, I’m gonna try because it must be great. You know, it was there was just so much noise in my head. And I just didn’t, I really needed something to focus me and just a roadmap and that’s what this course is. And it’s super affordable too, because it’s, I just want to help people.
Keep Wedding Photography Simple: How To Book, Shoot, and Deliver Weddings – CLICK HERE to get more info!
Sandra Henderson 34:48
I love that. Well, everybody makes sure you pop over onto my website and check out the show notes for this episode because I will definitely have the links there. Before we wrap things up. I would love if you could just tell the listeners were to follow you on social media so that they can continue checking out everything that you have to offer from here. Yeah, totally.
Jasmin Blais 35:07
Okay, so my Instagram is JC like the letter J-C. JC photography SK. I kind of shot myself in the footer with the SK but yeah, so @jcphotographysk and then my website is JC photographysk.com
Sandra Henderson 35:26
Awesome. Well, thank you so much for joining me for an interview today. This was absolutely amazing.
Jasmin Blais 35:32
Yes, thank you so much. I loved our chat.
Sandra Henderson 35:35
(Outro Music) Thank you so much for listening. You can find full show notes from today’s episode at simply simplysandrayvonne.ca/keepingitcandid in the meantime, let’s connect. You can find me on Instagram and Tiktok just search @simplysandrayvonne. And if you’re loving this podcast, I’d be so honored if you’d go ahead and hit that subscribe button and leave a review. Until next time! (Music fades out)
About Jasmin
Jasmin is a Saskatchewan-based photographer, that captures love stories and helps photographers reach their goals!
JC Photography
Sandra Henderson 0:00
There are two things you should know about me if you don’t already: one, I believe nothing makes a wedding day more perfect than working with a dream team of wedding vendors. And two, I’m a huge advocate for making sure that we’re doing the work to create a safe and welcoming space for every person that we cross paths with. So I was so excited to connect with my friend Kim from Curated by Kim Weddings to talk about how wedding vendors can work together to create that safe and welcoming space, not just for one another, but for the guests on a wedding day too, and how important it is to have open lines of communication with one another on the vendor team but especially with the planner and venue, so they can ensure that everyone is able to do their jobs to the best of their abilities. As we get ready to head into another wedding season, I think this is such an important conversation to have. The world is made up of all kinds of people and the wedding industry is no different. If we can take just five minutes of time to make sure that our colleagues the vendor team and the guests are able to enjoy the day and serve and celebrate the couple fully, then that five minutes was more than worth it. So let’s dive in and talk more about how we can do just that. This is episode 24 of Keeping It Candid.
Sandra Henderson 1:10
(Intro Music) Welcome to Keeping It Candid. I’m your host Sandra Henderson, an international wedding and family photographer and business coach. I help wedding photographers use systems to build out the back end of their businesses to gain control and continue to thrive no matter what life throws their way. And on a more personal note, I’m a strong Enneagram three weighing two who is obsessed with tacos and my love for traveling combined with navigating chronic illness life are just two of the many things that drive my passion for all things systems, workflows, and beating burnout as a business owner. Join me every week for a candid behind the scenes look at what it’s really like working as a wedding photographer, where I’ll give you actionable steps to take your business to the next level. Absolutely no fluff here friends! So go grab your favorite notebook and pen and let’s dive into this week’s episode. (Music fades out)
Sandra Henderson 1:58
Thank you so much for joining me Kim! I am so excited for our conversation today and for the topic that we have planned! But before we get started, if you could introduce yourself, let everybody know a little bit about you, that would be great!
Kim DeBose 2:11
Of course! Hi, everyone! My name is Kimberly DeBose. I am the owner and principal planner at Curated by Kim Weddings and Events. We are located in the beautiful state of Connecticut, and we plan weddings up and down the eastern seaboard. Our primary focus – our primary focus, in terms of wedding planning is really multicultural intercultural and interfaith weddings and events.
Sandra Henderson 2:41
I love that! I will never forget the day that I did- I was still working for another photographer at the time, but we did a Scottish-Filipino wedding. And both extended families flew in, they were, like, were like born and raised in their own countries and just their kids had come here and it was very early on in my time in the wedding industry, and I immediately became obsessed with any sort of fusion wedding. Seeing cultures blended together in such a special way is such a great way to… I shouldn’t say put a spin on the wedding day. But you know what I mean? Like it’s just- it’s so different than just you know, when your average Americans and Canadians – because we’re in two different countries – like just your regular wedding. You know what I mean?
Kim DeBose 3:25
Right. It’s just gives so much more depth and context and texture to the day and when you fuse cultures religions is just you know, is extra special for sure.
Sandra Henderson 3:38
Yeah, absolutely. I loved one moment during the reception where all of the Filipino family members were teaching cultural dances to the Irish family members, or sorry, it was Scottish, the Scottish family members that were there. And it was such a beautiful moment.
Kim DeBose 3:53
Absolutely. And it’s so colourful. And it’s just you know, just just just great. I love planning inter-cultural weddings, it’s just gives me, I love logistics. So there are tons of logistics attached to, to fusing those things. So I love it. And at the end of the day, each side embraces you because they’re all about family, embraces you so much and it’s just wonderful.
Sandra Henderson 4:18
Yeah. Oh, I totally agree. Never, I’ve never felt like so welcomed by a group of people than with my Arabic clients. Like, they open up their arms and welcome you into their home in such a special way. So, I can totally relate to all of that for sure. We are talking about a very, very important topic today. I think we are both in agreeance about that, about how wedding vendors can continue to show up for each other in the best way possible, especially vendors who have chronic illnesses that they’re navigating in their lives, especially on a wedding day. And the importance of communicating those things to one another and I think you have a really unique perspective as a wedding planner because with your couples, and then your vendors, you’re kind of like a middle point between the two. And so if people aren’t communicating with you, then it makes the whole day so much more difficult. I’m sure you can relate to that.
Kim DeBose 5:12
Definitely, and specifically when I’m one of my vendor friends, because most of the time my vendors become my vendor, friends and family, especially when we are all on the same page, it does get a little hairy. So we definitely can can talk about that. I am a full service planner, most of my clients come to me at the top of planning, maybe they have a venue, maybe they have a photographer, but for the most part, I am at the top of that food chain. And in that, I then go out and match them up with the best vendors that I can find that fit into their style, their budget. And just, you know, ones that I vibe with too, because we’re going to have to work together for an extended period of time. So so in that, I tried to develop a level of communication and trust, especially when I am throwing like, I don’t even have another term for it. But I’m saying, you know, hey, Sandra I have the perfect client for you, you don’t have to do anything but send me a contract. So especially when I’m kinda like throwing the business that way, I definitely hope to stay on the same page with all of my vendors. And if there’s something going on, I definitely want to be the first to know, because I can usually triage that for our mutual client.
Sandra Henderson 6:29
Yeah, that makes so much sense. And I think that there is a lot that goes into, from speaking to other planners, the recommendations that you do give, if you had a wedding that was going to be like, extremely, like a very, very long day, very physically demanding, there may be some photographers that you know personally and have that relationship with that just physically, not to any fault of their own and not in any sort of negative way, but physically just cannot meet the challenges and the demand of what that job will entail. And so I think being on that same page is super, super important. Because as a wedding planner, I’m sure you don’t want to recommend a couple that work with a wedding photographer, and then have them come and not only feel bad for the couple, but also feel bad for what the photographer is having to go through and things like that.
Kim DeBose 7:14
of course, in in terms of how I plan in the couples that I planned for most of their days are 18 hour days, we have Hindu or Muslim ceremonies at the top of the morning, 9:30- 10:00 in the morning, followed by a lunch, followed by a little two hour break, then we’re into more of the traditional American reception of you know, if it’s, you know, another culture in there, they may have a church service, followed by the reception. So we’re now talking about 17-18 hours. And if you’re a vendor, if I know that there is something that will prevent you from being able to stand on your feet, because we have taxing jobs, you know, physically taxing jobs on that day. But if there’s something that’s going to hinder your performance, I don’t want to match you up with a couple where you’re going to feel bad, and I’m going to feel bad and they don’t get their you know, shots or they don’t get you know, the right makeup applied. We all want to be satisfied when we were performing in our zone of genius. And we want the couples to be satisfied as well. So I may still, you know, recommend you, it may just be to a couple of us having an elopement and it’s not as physically taxing, or a couple that is more laid back and they don’t, they’re, they aren’t going to 17 different locations throughout this, you know, 18-19 hour day. It’s really about knowing my vendors and their preferences and and like we’re talking about their their health issues in order to be able to match them up with a couple.
Sandra Henderson 8:42
Yeah, absolutely. That’s so important. And I really… one of the like key takeaways that I hope people get from this episode is realizing that it’s not, it’s not a bad thing to say that someone is not capable of doing something when you’re having open and honest conversations and communication with that. It’s not that you’re looking at them in a negative light and saying, Well, you can’t do this because you have a chronic illness, it’s being on the same page and communicating with one another, recognizing what your abilities are. Because at the end of the day, we all want to serve the couple we all want them to have the best wedding day possible, the wedding day that they’ve been dreaming of. And creating that dream team of vendors is something that I talk about a lot on the podcast as well because we’re- nobody is there to do a disservice to another vendor. We’re not… we… there’s a lot of competing mentality or competition mentality that is in the industry. And I don’t think that it should be like I think we’re all there to serve the same goal. And so that open communication is so important from like, speaking for myself as someone with a chronic illness, it’s something that I would want to know because I know that the planner or whatever other vendors that I’m working with, they want the same thing, is that they want the couple to have the dream day and I don’t want to show up knowing that I’m going to be pushing myself outside of my limitations because that will also start To take away from other clients that I have as well, after that wedding day. So yeah, I love that you said that. And I think that’s so important.
Kim DeBose 10:07
And and just to piggyback off of what you said, it doesn’t take, it doesn’t mean that you can’t do something, it just means that that’s not your specific lane or zone, you may take gorgeous pictures, and I may say, You know what, Sandra, or Sarah or whomever? I do 20-hour wedding days, but I love your photography style, how about we set up a branding shoot for you and I, you know, I want- I need branding photos, or I need some behind the scenes stuff. So maybe you come on the job for two or three hours and capture that stuff for me. So there are different pockets that we can fulfill in order to be able to be in this financial ecosystem without feeling like I have to totally take you out of consideration for any jobs.
Sandra Henderson 10:50
Yeah, that’s awesome. That’s so so important. I love that, that’s actually something that I just started dipping my toe into a little bit this year, is doing what I’ve called detail sessions for planners and vendors where I come out to the wedding venue before the actual, like, hired photographers are there so that we’re respecting each other’s boundaries and things like that. And just getting those photos that these companies are not often able to get to on or get sorry, on the wedding day for whatever reason that may be, and it’s still a way for us to be able to work together and to collaborate and network without having any like, you know, awkward, like we’ve been saying, like awkward situations or situations where people feel like they’re letting others down and things like that.
Kim DeBose 11:35
For sure, and that’s great to be open to that it’s a it’s an additional revenue stream, you know, sometimes getting a client with a with a nice big five figure budget for photography is amazing. But sometimes it’s not worth the headache. So if you can’t do it, and you don’t want to do it, coming in and doing a smaller job may you know be enough to satisfy your palate and produce the work for you as well to be able to then market to other planners or other you know, florists or whatever the case is and open up another lane for you. And I am always going to recommend people that I vibe with, people that I know their work has their- they have integrity, and their work speaks for itself. So there may be another planner that doesn’t do multicultural weddings, but does a different type of wedding and their weddings are eight hours And that may just be it, and the photographer’s hi- hired for six hours, I’d still be able to recommend you and be able to stand by your work and let them know that you’re a great fit and do that in good conscience.
Sandra Henderson 12:40
Is there anything that you do throughout the planning process or on a wedding day to accommodate for the needs of guests and vendors that you, especially with guests, like you’re having these huge guest lists, you might not necessarily know all the needs and accommodations that everybody is looking for. So is there anything that you do to just kind of like do a base level of anything?
Kim DeBose 13:02
So I definitely ask my couples throughout the process, if there’s- in my questionnaire is when we drill down to like logistics, you know, is there anyone with some special needs? And it’s just not in terms of special needs. Is there anyone that we have to worry about when it comes to the alcohol? Or is there anyone that we have to come, come we come into this a little handsy? You know, we we ask a bunch of you’d be surprised.
Sandra Henderson 13:29
Very important question.
Kim DeBose 13:31
Like who is going to touch my butt? Like I want to know. So I can tell Uncle John that you know, I can.. you know.. I just need to know! So…
Sandra Henderson 13:41
Yeah, totally! I know exactly what you mean!
Kim DeBose 13:44
it keep my staff on high alert and so that I’m not uncomfortable at Uncle John isn’t uncomfortable, even though he’s the one doing the touching. So there’s a broad spectrum of questions we ask. And in that I ask, I specifically ask if there are any guests or anyone in the wedding party or parents whatever the case is that need any special accommodations. I have a bride who was getting married September 10. She just had a baby July 12. And I know just in our conversations, as you know, her new moms and I’m not a new mom, but just moms. I know that she’s breastfeeding. So in our first timeline meeting yesterday, I asked her you know, where do you plan on pumping? Do you plan on nursing? Do you plan on doing any of those things so I can have a space for you that’s quiet. So you have some reprieve, that’s sanitary. I need to build that into my timeline. And I need to know that can happen so I can whisk you away. So I want everyone it’s my primary responsibility for things that go off without a hitch. And I need to be aware of all of the things that involve all of the people including vendors in order to be able to do that. If you are a vendor with a chronic illness, and you need to take an hour break, let’s build that in around speeches or when people are going through the buffet line, if they have a buffet, let’s build in, you know, a longer time maybe I put an hour in there for eating time and you you take your break, then you’re not capturing anyone when they’re eating, you know, and then maybe we build speeches out a little later in the evening. I have to know all of these things in order to make decisions that are beneficial for every party involved.
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Sandra Henderson 15:25
Yeah, absolutely. I love that you brought that up. And I love that you mentioned questionnaires. Because in getting ready for this episode, I actually posted to a different- a couple of different communities that I’m in and asked them like, what is something if you’ve ever been in at a wedding, or if you are in the wedding industry, and you’ve ever needed an accommodation at a wedding, what’s something that someone could have done proactively to make the situation a little more comfortable for you, because something that happens a lot, and something that I’ve even faced myself, is not feeling comfortable asking for those sorts of accommodations, we want to try and fit ourselves into the box of an abled person who doesn’t have any chronic illnesses or anything else on their plate that they’re having to juggle as well as doing their job. And so one of the responses that I got was actually a questionnaire. And I thought that this was such a great idea, even from like, as a wedding photographer, I still like to build those connections with different vendors. And the responses to me like from a florist or someone like that is not necessarily as important on the photography side as it would be to the planner side of things because you are having to juggle so many different pieces of the puzzle for the wedding day. But I also send out a questionnaire to my own couples, whether it be for the wedding day, or my family clients or anything like that asking them similar questions, like you were saying like is during family photos is there anybody who has mobility limitations, it’s going to need flat ground that can’t, you know, go down a grassy hill to do photos, for example, is there anybody that needs photos to be done in a sensory friendly area, because one of my very first weddings actually, I was not given any of this information. I was still in college, I didn’t even know to ask any of these questions. And we had all the lights off in a fairly small hall, because dancing was happening, the DJ had some lights, we were taking photos with our flashes. And nobody told us that one of the guests had epilepsy. And so because of all the lights flashing between us and the DJ, it ended up triggering a seizure and we had to call an ambulance and one of the guests had to be rushed out. And so it really kind of early on painted a picture for me of like, why this sort of information is so important as a photographer, and then I think like 10 times more important for you as a wedding… Sorry, wedding planner.
Kim DeBose 17:43
The worst, the worst thing that can happen is that the police are called in, or an ambulance is called on your wedding day, because no matter what happens, that overshadows all of the things, you know, you could have had a perfect day, and at the end of the day, if your cousin needs to be rushed to the hospital, it’s just always going to stick out whenever you think about your wedding. So and that can be fairly traumatic, especially after the 1000s of dollars you’ve spent. Um, so knowing and having that information upfront, just kind of mitigates that. I have found and like you, I’ve started to ask these questions with experience. And I find that when I send out a questionnaire and I asked you, you know, who’s handsy? Or who can consume too much alcohol or all of those things, you know, I’m open to getting that feedback. So you, the transparency is there, I’ve asked you, now it’s up to you to be able to give me that information. And that opens the door to be more comfortable in person to continue to have that conversation. But if I don’t ask, you know, you might not even think to tell me. So I’ve discovered throughout my business journey, that it’s important to ask questions, and all you can do is write n/a if it’s not applicable to you in the questionnaire.
Sandra Henderson 18:58
Yeah, absolutely.
Kim DeBose 18:59
When you do when we do that, and it becomes a three step process, you know, questionnaire, conversation and implementation if need be. It just makes it easier, more discreet for that person, because you need to still have some discretion in that. And it makes them feel loved. And it makes them feel seen. And it makes me feel good too.
Sandra Henderson 19:22
That’s such a good point that you brought up that it makes people feel seen. I love that. And so I know a lot of people who are listening to this and are struggling with things like chronic illness, or struggling with, you know, being open and communicating their needs to others to make those accommodations, I would love to put their minds at ease and just ask you is, Has there ever been a situation where someone has asked for an accommodation and there has been negative feedback from another vendor or venue or the couple or anything like that?
Kim DeBose 19:57
not in my experience. I haven’t you know I don’t come across that personally. And if someone asked me personally to, you know, make some accommodations for them, I wouldn’t, you know, write them off, I would try my best to be able to do what I can do in that space and time, especially if I know, before, I’m sure I’m positive if people have felt like they haven’t been seen or heard, I just haven’t crossed paths with someone that I’ve, you know, had that experience with. And I hope that I don’t, I hope we can, we can stop for five or 10 minutes if need be, to be able to give whomever that is a space and time to regroup. Or to make changes. Like I say, timelines aren’t flexible, but they’re the most flexible and disregarded thing in the entire world. So I can build some time in anywhere and get it I have people in my my personal life that have some, you know, chronic illnesses, and we just have to make those accommodations. So I have personal experience. So I just happened to be a little, I happen to be sensitive, but I’m sure there are other planners or venues that aren’t necessarily as sensitive.
Sandra Henderson 21:10
Yeah, I totally agree. I’m sure they’re like the world takes all kinds. And I’m sure there are people out there who are not as welcoming or as accommodating. But I think overall, the majority of people that we will come across are gonna have absolutely no issues with making any sort of accommodation. And like you said, like building an extra five minutes in here and there won’t be an issue. I think that a lot of us are just worried about the what ifs and the fact that we aren’t fitting into the same box as another photographer. And so I love hearing perspectives from other vendor- Other vendors who are coming across these situations who can say like, Yeah, I’m sure it exists, but it hasn’t happened, for me, and in my experience, because I think that’s gonna give people a little bit more confidence as they’re going forward to be able to openly speak about these things.
Kim DeBose 21:59
Absolutely. And I want you, I would want the listeners to feel comfortable. And being able to give out that information and know that sometimes things come off so harsh, especially when we’re in the decision making process of the day. Every one is kind of like cut and dry for the most part. So for me, I try to take more care with my vendors, because I need something in return, like what’s on your photos to be perfect. So I tried to definitely take my tone down a little bit, and, and really have personal conversations, look them in the eye and get a little closer Well, not all the times, but they’re a little closer. So that we all feel more comfortable. And we know we can rely on each other to be able to give each other whatever we need to make the day go off without a hitch. So I haven’t personally had that experience because I tried to be personable, I tried to be funny, I tried to leave with love, in order for my vendor team to feel comfortable. Because we have to work together.
Sandra Henderson 23:05
I love that. So so true. Well, do you have any final words of encouragement or final thoughts about the communication process with your vendors and things like that,
Kim DeBose 23:16
of course, I My tip would be to cultivate relationships across all wedding professional communities. Because if Island talks to planners, and you only talk to photographers and makeup artists only talk to makeup artists, and so on and so on. And we have conversations about what’s actually happening in our real lives. But we don’t have overlapping conversations. And we do not, you know, develop relationships with people and other lanes, we never get to what’s really happening in our personal lives. And I can’t get that out of you or I don’t know, if we haven’t made that connection. And you don’t you may not feel comfortable with telling me. And it’s important to develop those relationships so that we can you know, work, we can be friends and we can work together. Well, that will be the first thing. And the next thing to me in terms of being a planner is if you have something going on, and maybe my couples didn’t book you through me or you weren’t one of my recommendations. If you know I’m a planner on the team, because I always reach out to you know, my couples, other vendors as soon as they you know, sign up for me sign up with me if they are like a wedding management package. Let me know don’t go smoke couple you know, and I know you’re not intentionally ghosting my couple, but they’re now emailing me 50 times to be able to find you and they’re emailing you 100 times and it just maybe you need a second you need a break. But if I know that and you even tell me to the side that you need a second, I can pacify them for lack of a better word I can you know say well, you know, Sandra and I have connected we’re working on your timeline. She’s inundated with weddings. She’s given me the green light on what she needs to execute your day. She will be there she’ll be ready to work we’ve we’ve done all of these things, you know, behind the scenes to map things out. If you just tell me I can cover your cover your ass and cover buying two?
Sandra Henderson 25:14
For sure. Yes, lots of ass covering is needed from a dream team of vendors on a wedding day. We are all human. We’re all imperfect. We all need breaks, things happen, especially on the bigger crazier wedding day. So yeah, that whole thing is so so important. And that actually inspired me for one last little thought that I would love to throw at you. Do you have any encouragement or thoughts to share with other vendors on the importance of reaching out and making those connections with the vendors that they’re going to be working with? Whether that be other planners who are just starting out, or photographers or anyone like that? What has your experience been like?
Kim DeBose 25:48
So I am oftentimes in a unique position, because I am the planner. And in that, I find that every every couple that I work with has a planner, because I’m there. But not every couple you work with, or the DJ works with other makeup artists works with have a planner, so you have a different set of experiences that I don’t have, because if I’m there, I’m there. So I find that DJ, my photographer, my videographer, they all morph into planners, but you have to when you don’t have boots on the ground. So I love to kind of ease into that relationship, because I know that if you have 15 Weddings this year, statistically, only five of them have planners. And so you do have to have that hat on. But when it’s my day, you don’t have to have that one, you can, you know, kind of let that go. Let me do my job and we don’t have to fight, we can just you know, you can just be relieved that today’s the day you don’t have to be a planner. So I find that if we can collaborate and get to know each other outside of wedding days and wedding weeks. I find that photographers once they really get to know their favorite planners sing their praises, because they’re like, listen, I can get all the shots that I want. And for a planner, it’s staying in my lane to like I shouldn’t be posing people like what do I do? Like, I should be telling people get your behind right there and let the photographer do his or her job. And then go on and put on another fire. So and we communicate and we network and we have fun and we have drinks or we have coffee or whatever the case is outside of outside of a wedding week or wedding day we can really get to you know, let people work in their zones of genius.
Sandra Henderson 27:34
For sure. So important on a wedding day to let people work in their zones of genius. I love that you said that. Well, that was amazing. Thank you so much before we officially wrap things up, if you could just let everybody know where to find you online so they can go and give you a follow.
Kim DeBose 27:49
Of course, thank you for having me. I truly appreciate it. It was so nice connecting with you and your audience, and really speaking to the other sides of the wedding professional world. I am @curatedbykimweddings on Instagram. I am @curatedbykimweddings on Facebook. And you can also catch me on the World Wide Web because I’m older than 37 Insanely – Curated By Kim Weddings And Events. So that’s where I am. That’s where I hang out. Of course, we plan up and down the East Coast, then you know we will get on a plane if you buy the ticket.
Sandra Henderson 28:27
Yes, I love that. Hopefully I’ve got some Canadian listeners that will fly you over to the side of the border because I would love a chance to work together one day.
Kim DeBose 28:35
Absolutely, absolutely for sure.
Sandra Henderson 28:37
Awesome. Well, I’m so grateful for you and this conversation. Thank you so much again and I cannot wait to talk more soon.
Kim DeBose 28:44
Thank you.
Sandra Henderson 28:45
(Outro Music) Thank you so much for listening. You can find full show notes from today’s episode at simplysandrayvonne.ca/keepingitcandid. In the meantime, let’s connect! You can find me on Instagram and Tiktok just search @simplysandrayvonne. And if you’re loving this podcast, I’d be so honored if you’d go ahead and hit that subscribe button and leave a review. Until next time! (Music fades out)
About Kim
Kimberly DeBose is the principal planner at Curated by Kim, Weddings, and Events. Kimberly has over 5 years of experience with planning weddings and social events in Connecticut, New York, and New Jersey + beyond. Kim’s love for events runs deep! She watched her mother and aunt put together some of the most fabulous events, which piqued her interest at an early age. The elegant courses, the design, and of course the gathering of family and friends was always the highlight. Planning was just a natural fit. After working for a boutique wedding planning and design company as an assistant, Kim decided to strike out on her own. CBK serves multicultural couples whose wedding day honors their deep love and affinity for their culture while fusing in elements that are reflective of their modern love story. Outside of stalking beautifully executed events all over Instagram, Kim spends her time loving on her family. Wife to Andre, mom to Andrew, Axel & Alaina, and new puppy Bingo, Kim’s hands are full!
Sandra Henderson 0:02
It’s our first interview for 2023 and we are kicking things off with a good one! Today I’m chatting with my friend Nova from Nova Markina Photography. She is an amazingly talented wedding photographer and educator, and all around just one of the loveliest people that I have you ever met in this industry.
Sandra Henderson 0:20
We did used to be neighbours here in London, so I have the honour of calling her a friend in real life, but over the last couple of years, she and her family have spent some time living abroad. So when we connected for this interview, we talked about things like the steps she took to create a remote business that can thrive no matter where she’s living in the world, and all about the importance of creating a work life balance as a business owner.
Sandra Henderson 0:41
You’re listening to Episode 23 of Keeping It Candid.
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Sandra Henderson 0:44
(Intro music) Welcome to Keeping It Candid. I’m your host, Sandra Henderson, an international wedding and family photographer and business coach. I help wedding photographers use systems to build out the back end of their businesses to gain control and continue to thrive no matter what life throws their way. And on a more personal note, I’m a strong Enneagram three weighing two who is obsessed with tacos and my love for traveling combined with navigating chronic illness life are just two of the many things that drive my passion for all things systems, workflows, and beating burnout as a business owner. Join me every week for a candid behind the scenes look at what it’s really like working as a wedding photographer, where I’ll give you actionable steps to take your business to the next level. Absolutely no fluff here friends! So go grab your favorite notebook and pen and let’s dive into this week’s episode. (Music fades out)
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Sandra Henderson 1:33
All right, well, thank you so much for joining me on the podcast today. I’m so excited to have you!
Nova Markina 1:39
Thank you, Sandra. I’m excited to be here. I’m actually so excited, I showed up 30 minutes early.
Sandra Henderson 1:44
It happens! I did that, when I saw you for spring minis on the weekend, I went and parked and I looked at my phone and I was like ‘my session doesn’t start for 40 minutes…’
Nova Markina 1:57
It’s good to be excited.
Sandra Henderson 1:58
Right? Awesome. Well tell us a little bit about yourself and where we can find you on social media and all that kind of fun stuff.
Nova Markina 2:05
Alright, so my name is Nova Markina, I am a wedding photographer, based in London, Ontario, Canada, but I do shoot you know, across the country and internationally. My Instagram and all of my social media handles are just my name. So @novamarkina, so be sure to check that out. And then my website is super simple, it’s novamarkina.ca.
Sandra Henderson 2:27
Awesome. Yes, super easy to remember across the board. And so you mentioned that you do international wedding photography, and that was kind of the inspiration behind me wanting to bring you on the podcast for today’s episode, because I have known you for so long and I’ve seen how your business has transitioned from being local to the London area and then going abroad from there, what has that experience been like for you?
Nova Markina 2:57
It has been a whirlwind. And it’s been wonderful. So you know, pre- we’ll say, March 2020, my business was, you know, taking off in terms of destination weddings and all of that. And then you know, things kind of changed. So we weren’t shooting as much even at home. And then basically once we got the go-ahead that like travel was okay and whatnot, we jumped right back in. My husband and I have always been travelers, you know, that was always the big picture goal for us to do something crazy in our lives and spend time elsewhere. So this past winter, we had the luxury of being able to uproot our family, we took our daughter, she’s 18 months now. So the three of us went to Mexico, and we worked abroad for six months. So during that time, I wasn’t necessarily shooting, I was just kind of getting back into, you know, being away and building those relationships for being away. I was diving a lot into my mentorship and teaching programs. Yeah, and then at the end of our trip, you know, I did my first destination wedding of the year, and it’s just gonna go from there, it’s gonna get really busy. From there, we’ve got our weddings at home and our shoots at home and then next winter, we’re gonna dive back into shooting abroad.
Sandra Henderson 4:11
I love that! I will admittedly tell you that I was like, stalking your stories the whole time you were in Mexico, because Mexico is my favorite place in the whole world. And so yeah, I was just living vicariously through your Instagram the whole time you’re away!
Nova Markina 4:24
Next time, you’ll just have to come visit!
Sandra Henderson 4:26
Exactly! You definitely don’t have to ask me twice to go to Mexico! I love it. Um, so what kinds of things do you think you had to structure in your business to be able to take that time off? I know it did coincide with our off-season here in Canada, but was there anything that you had to do in advance to be able to give yourself that freedom to be able to work abroad?
Nova Markina 4:49
Yeah, I think there was a lot leading up to it in terms of how I structured my business that did make things easier once we made the decision. Having said that, there were you know, Oh, that last minute tweaks that we had to make as well. But in terms of how I run my business and how, you know, it’s sort of evolved, I put a lot of emphasis on systems and workflows, and setting client expectations and setting personal expectations, to know sort of where the line between personal time and work time comes into play. I know a lot of us can get like, overwhelmed with working all the time, and oh, I’ve got a spot in my calendar open, so I won’t take time for myself at all, you know, I’ll be working as much as possible. So just setting up systems that would allow me to make sure that I was always delivering a good client experience for, you know, my clients, my photography clients, and my students, especially being away, you don’t know… I always look at a at a trip as ‘I don’t know if I’ll be back’, or ‘I don’t know if I’ll have the opportunity to be back.’ So it’s easier to set those boundaries and set those time those times in your calendar, because you can work really hard and really smart. And then you can take a couple hours off so that you can enjoy where you are. I find being at home, it’s really easy to just be like, ‘You know what, I’ll just keep working.’ So, you know, being really strict on my time and my schedules and my workflows, so that I could be efficient.
Sandra Henderson 6:18
I love that – you are totally speaking my language, 100%.
Nova Markina 6:22
Yes, we love the workflows!
Sandra Henderson 6:23
Right?! And just like you were saying, instead of like prioritizing that time to yourself, because if you are, typically, when you’re at home, and you leave that block open on your calendar, a lot of times, it’s so easy to just be like, ‘Oh, well, I’ll just work, I’ll just fill in another session.’ But I always am telling people, like, not every day is meant to be a day behind your camera. There’s a whole business to run outside of the creative side. There’s also having time off which you need. And I don’t think a lot of people, or enough people, put priority on taking time off.
Nova Markina 6:55
Oh my gosh, I couldn’t agree more. And I think what, a couple of things have really like changed my mindset around work. One of them being that we don’t become self employed individuals, the dream of becoming a self employed individual is not to work 24/7, right, the dream is to do what we love, and then have the life that we love. And I think that gets lost really quickly when we’re trying to hustle and build and gain that momentum. So it’s kind of taking a step back to realize like, ‘Okay, I want to build the business with my dreams, but it’s so that I can also have the life of my dreams,’ – to be able to set those boundaries and, you know, having a baby during, you know, a very tumultuous time, that also kind of changed my priorities a bit. And that’s not to say that photography is less important to me, but it’s, it’s – I figured out a way to, when I’m in that, be very focused with that and dedicated to that. And then when I move out of that, you know, you know if it’s time off or evenings off, I’m dedicated and present when I’m not in it. So I’m dedicated to what I’m doing in that moment.
Sandra Henderson 8:03
Yeah, absolutely. That’s so important. I think like, when it comes to taking time off, it’s not necessarily just like not working, like actually removing yourself from the headspace and allowing yourself be present in the things that you have outside of work contributes to how relaxed and refreshed you are, and refilling your own cups that you can keep serving other people.
Nova Markina 8:23
Yes. Oh, I love that filling your own cup.
Sandra Henderson 8:25
I love those little, like, visuals! And all of my visuals and comparisons always relate to like food or drink in some way. Just how I roll.
Nova Markina 8:33
I can relate. I do like that.
Sandra Henderson 8:36
So you talked a little bit about like balancing the two while you were in Mexico and while you’re at home. Do you think that work/life balance is something that is achievable? Is it like an end goal? Do you think it’s a catchphrase? Do you think it’s something that you have to always be working on? What are your thoughts on work/life balance?
Nova Markina 8:54
Um, so I’ve got a few answers to a few of those questions. So I do think it is attainable. I think it is very necessary. But I do think it’s a work in progress. Because all businesses and all parts of your life are going to have peaks and valleys. And there are going to be times where, you know, wedding season for us where we might only be working six or eight months out of the year. We don’t live in California, we have to really nose to the- nose to the ground, and be working and we might have two or three wedding weekends. So sometimes I think in our business, it’s not completely possible. But I think to be reminding yourself that when you can be doing it you should be.
Sandra Henderson 9:35
Yeah, absolutely. That makes so much sense especially for like you were saying those of us that have the six to eight month wedding season. It kind of… There are times where you really have to just kind of have some looseness on your boundaries. Give them a little bit of wiggle room. Don’t completely get rid of them, because then you end up getting to October and you’re exhausted and miserable and totally burnt out. But yeah, at least having a little bit of flexibility so that you can make the best of both situations.
Nova Markina 10:03
Absolutely.
Sandra Henderson 10:04
So what was your inspiration in going to either like, just abroad in general or specifically Mexico? I know, you said that you and your husband have always loved to travel. But what was kind of like the deciding factor, like, it’s time, and we’re gonna go, and we’re gonna make this work.
Nova Markina 10:23
So we did a little trial run trip in November. So you know, traveling, your first trip after what’s been going on, you know, with travel restrictions and whatnot, is kind of a nerve wracking one, you know, we have a baby, and is it responsible and safe and possible and doable to be traveling abroad. So we picked somewhere where if something were to happen, we could be home quickly, a short flight, and we picked somewhere that we were familiar with. So I have been to that coast, like the Cancun coast of Mexico, nearly 20 times. So I was like, you know, it’s familiar. I know what to expect when I get there. So that was sort of why we chose that location. We did a trial ride, you know, flights with the baby and what to pack and over packing and unpacking certain things. So we did that in November, we realized it was doable. And then we booked a trip in for December. So we left December 27. And we were going to say for one month, you know, one month abroad is, like, kind of crazy! And the whole idea being ‘we’re not vacationing.’ Everyone’s like ‘oh my gosh, you’re going on a month vacation. That’s so nice!’ And I had to kind of reframe it where it’s. we’re – no, we’re uprooting. So we’re yes, we’re going to be able to enjoy sun and palm trees and sand and ocean, but also seeing what it is like to work somewhere else. So having the work/life balance in a different country, just the two of us there to parent, no outside help, no nannies or daycares or anything like that. So figuring out what that meant for work. And then it came, you know, the end of January, and a couple of crazy things started happening here in Canada. So we decided to extend our trip. And before you know it, we were looking at another Airbnb, we had, I think, successfully figured out a good work/life balance in January. And so we did, we extended our trip. It was a little nerve wracking because you know, you had to cross some T’s and dot some I’s for back home, and to make sure everything was taken care of. But I have no regrets about doing it. We got on the plane to come back home when our trip was over and Matt was already talking about, you know, ‘so next year when we do this, and are we going to do it a bit longer?’ and thinking about all of these possibilities, are we going to stay in this a place or adventure elsewhere? So I have no regrets. And I really think that if people are able to do something like that, that they absolutely should. It’s terrifying and exciting all at the same time.
Sandra Henderson 12:46
Totally. I love traveling. And the idea of doing that – it definitely, like, gives me a little bit of anxiety, but also like excites me so much. Yeah, you guys were definitely some inspiration for me in my life. I was like ‘we’re gonna make this happened one day, and we’ll just be neighbors with Nova and Matt like we used to be neighbors in real life.
Nova Markina 13:05
Yes, totally!
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Sandra Henderson 13:07
Um, so what was it like with the actual work aspect? I know you said that you didn’t have a destination wedding until the very end because you were focusing on just like, trying to figure out the structure and that end of things. So how did it work out with everything that you had put into place in advance once you got there? What was the actual work side of things like for you?
Nova Markina 13:30
Um, the work side was very, very similar to had I been home because it was the mentoring side of my business. So it was, you know, Zoom calls and chats and correspondence with students. So it was more working from home… Home, our home in Mexico, and not going out and shooting, which kind of made it easier, in a sense, because I was able to stack my day in terms of have- having, you know, calls at certain times and then being able to go out at other times. But yeah, I would say because we moved things over, we… I basically did what I would have been doing at home, except when I looked outside there was a palm tree and not rain or snow!
Sandra Henderson 14:10
Right. That’s the dream right there! I love Canada but I’m also not built for these cold temperatures even a little bit.
Nova Markina 14:20
Plus you love tacos, so you would have loved it there.
Sandra Henderson 14:23
Honestly, like there’s a million things I absolutely love about Mexico! We- I’ve been to the east coast a couple of times, but my heart lives over on the West Coast. Matt and I are planning a trip over there.
Nova Markina 14:34
West side is the best side?
Sandra Henderson 14:35
Right! But yeah, there’s this tiny little cape town called Sayultia and it has- it holds a world record for, like, the most colourful flags that they’ve strung up above the streets. You can just like walk down, like, colourful rainbow streets. And while we were there, like, we were on the beach, and my husband watched a fisherman get off a boat and like walk into the back of a restaurant. He’s like “we’re going for fish tacos!”
Nova Markina 15:00
Oh my gosh, that’s amazing.
Sandra Henderson 15:02
I can’t wait to go and stay there. So if you could give photographers who are just starting to like dip their toes in the water of, like, wanting to explore doing destination weddings, what would you- what advice would you give to them?
Nova Markina 15:16
Ooh, destination weddings and how to jump into that… I would start by like a super, it sounds super easy, but if you want to do destination weddings, you have to let everybody know that you want to do destination weddings. Because one, they’re going to be very popular. You know, they’re, they’re gaining momentum again, and so everybody knows somebody who knows somebody who’s going to be getting married down south. So there is, it… There is a really nice advantage to bringing a photographer from home. So just getting the word out there that that’s something that you want to be doing, you know, chatting about it, I saw a Reel once and it was like ‘you have to talk about your business to have a business.’ So talking about it as much as possible, be it in person and people that you know, mentioning it on socials, all of that, but also remembering that while it is luxurious and adventurous and fun, and you might just want to, you know, ‘will shoot for sun!’ and do it for free, I would highly recommend against that. Because you have to take into consideration that going away has a lot of things that you have to- a lot of things to check off, a lot of things to keep track of. You are leaving probably for a week, so you know, a week of worth is work is gone. You have to make sure you have proper insurances and all of this. And there’s a lot that goes into it. So pricing yourself and valuing- valuing yourself accordingly so that you can do it, so that it’s advantageous for yourself and the couple that’s bringing you, not doing it for free. But also maybe you know, not… You might not be able to charge an exorbitant amount to begin with. So yeah, so talking about your business to have a business in terms of letting people know that that’s something that you want to do. I think that’s the short of that one.
Sandra Henderson 17:06
Yeah, for sure. I love that – you have to talk about your business to have a business. I want to, like, one of my big goals this year was reminding myself that… Actually, I’ll just like steal the way a friend of mine said it yesterday, it’s that we’re the only ones who get tired of hearing our own marketing. Like, not everybody is hearing or seeing every single thing that we do. So we have to remind ourselves that like, consistency, and fre- or I should say, frequency, is key and just continuing to always talk about your business.
Nova Markina 17:34
Yes. And we, I totally, totally feel that because, you know, we’re talking about our business every day. And there was a percentage I saw somewhere, and it’s like, only, and I’ll have to check this number, but like 2% of your followers are seeing it. So if you have 100 followers and two people are seeing it, like, it will feel old for you to be able to reach the other 98% of them.
Sandra Henderson 17:58
Right.
Nova Markina 17:58
So yeah, reminding yourself about that. Because some days, I’m like, Oh, I would rather talk about anything else. But then the people who want to hear it stick around the people who don’t we attract we repel. But that’s a whole other conversation.
Sandra Henderson 18:10
Right? Yeah, that that can go into a whole entire podcast on its own, which I’ll probably add that to my list and then just get in touch again. So we can do this again!
Nova Markina 18:17
Sounds good! I love that topic!
Sandra Henderson 18:20
All right. And so stealing one more piece of advice from you, if you could give photographers who are wanting to get their freedom back in their lives and start working towards having a more balanced work and home life, what piece of advice would you give them for that?
Nova Markina 18:36
I love this. I love this because it took me longer than I would like to admit to figure it out, to figure it out.
Sandra Henderson 18:42
Same here.
Nova Markina 18:42
Now… Yes, it took me too long! But now that I’ve gained momentum in it, I feel like everybody should know how to do it. And it’s, it’s a tough thing to have this, this balance. But I think a lot of us are unaware with how we spend our time, like a lot of us don’t even realize what are the time- what’s taking our time, and where we’re spending our time. So I would first and foremost, start with tracking your time. Like, without thinking about it too much, go about a day or a week, and do what you do and track your time, and how- like, I know my week, I know how much time I’m going to spend in the car. I know what how much time I’m going to spend, you know, on meals and personal time and work and emails. And it’s really advantageous. And at first, it might feel constricting, but it is quite liberating when you can figure out exactly where your time is going, and then you realize, oh, this was a really inefficient use of time. So starting with tracking it, and there’s tracking apps to do that. Pen and paper always works too. And to know that there’s always room for improvement. And then I would say another huge thing, and this also took me longer to do than I would like to admit… And I don’t know if you’re in the same boat, you’ll have to let me know, but is eliminating things that I don’t love doing.
Nova Markina 18:43
Yes, absolutely, that is a huge one! That’s like second to getting your systems in order and then stop doing the things that you don’t like, whether it be a type of session that you offer – no offense to all of my newborn clients, I love you, but I can’t do newborns anymore! My heart is just not in it, and I don’t enjoy doing it. And then the little things like editing, and you know, your bookkeeping and all those kinds of things, even housework, like, you don’t have to do all of it, we can’t do all of it. And I know like, as I’m sure you can relate to this, as women, we feel like we have to do all of it. And it’s just, it’s impossible. So starting with the things that you don’t enjoy doing that you don’t have to do yourself is so important.
Nova Markina 20:45
So important. And I know that myself, I had trouble letting go of that control. But it was quite liberating once I took things off the list, and then it gives your mind more opportunity and resources to spend on the things that you do like doing. And then like you said, with the systems. So I now spend more time with my clients. Like not personally, we’re not hanging out and having coffee, but I’m able to, I mean, sometimes we do, I’m able to invest more time into, you know, I think the client experience is really important. So I can spend more time on that. And I can have systems and workflows and emails that allow my couples to to know that I am on the same page with them, that I’m in touch with them, that I’m available, that I’m a resource for them regarding their photography experience. For some people, this is one of the first photo shoots that they might be having, and they’re nervous about it. So you know, being a resource for them in that regard, or helping them with days of their, or aspects of, their wedding day that they might not even think about, you know. We’re not wedding planners, but I can help a couple with like, how to make sure you have beautiful wedding, bridal detail photos, and letting them know things like that. So that’s where I’ve sort of shifted, because I really have been enjoying letting people know how to make the best of their experience. And that, again, could be a whole other topic, you know, the client, is exceeding client expectations and how that will move the needle in your business. But yeah, so basically, in short, the time tracking, take things that you don’t love doing out and then build systems that are sustainable and helpful.
Sandra Henderson 22:24
I love all of that. So, so much. You talked a little bit throughout the podcast about the mentoring side of your business and the students that you work with. And I know you just launched a brand new Facebook group! So why don’t you tell us a little bit about that?
Nova Markina 22:38
Yes. Oh, my gosh, okay, so I launched the Facebook group, you are part of my inspiration, I know that you’ve had that going on for a while. We actually, it’s so neat to see, because we started our businesses at such a similar time. And we’ve evolved so similarly, you know, and we both have our mentorship programs. And I think that’s so exciting! But yeah, in terms of the Facebook group, specifically, I’ll tell you a little bit about that. So on my Instagram, you know, Instagram and social media is like one of the best things and worst things to have happened to my business. It is how I started my business, and now I admittedly, I find it a little bit overwhelming. And then you know, you have your profile, and people are following you because they love seeing maybe the behind the scenes with the travel part or the photography part. And it kind of became a little bit murky in my head, and I wanted to show all of the aspects of my life, and then I realized that the photographers who follow me would be better served if I could have a place where I could deep dive into things. And I do have my mentorship program, but I really liked the idea of this where there could be a community and we could start conversations and they could feed off of each other and ask each other and answer each other questions so that it’s not just me all of the time. And I’ve just been sharing tidbits of like tips and tricks, and while it’s not a deep dive into the actual entire program, because that is a- that is a like one on one, we’re gonna dive into your business, we’re gonna make it awesome situation if you’re a photographer who just needs a little bit of guidance here and there. I thought it would be a neat way to build a community.
Sandra Henderson 24:13
Yeah, absolutely. I think Facebook groups, even though like there’s millions of them, and one of the things that kind of like had me hesitating before I started mine was like, ‘Do we really need more Facebook groups?’ but I think it’s the community aspect, it’s so great, other photographers being able to share their expertise, because even as educators and business coaches, we don’t know all the things. There’s definitely, like, our expertise and like systems and workflows and things like that. But you know, for me, like if someone wants, you know, contract advice about their clauses, they should probably go talk to a lawyer. And so it’s just like, being able to have a community where people can share their experiences, I think is so beneficial on, like, and for every photographer to just continue learning how other people do things.
Nova Markina 24:56
No, I love what you were saying because I noticed that, at you know, in terms of other people having expertise in other areas, I, I’ve noticed that I like sign off every post with ‘…but share how you do it!’ because I was sharing, you know my backup systems. But that’s not the only way to do it, it might not be the best way to do it. And I’m always here to learn too. So if somebody can give me some tips on like, this is their strategy and this is how they do it, and everybody’s mind works differently. So maybe if somebody were to contribute with a comment, and you were to or somebody else were to see it, and they liked the other contributors version of it more, you know, it’s helpful. It’s not just what I have to say. So it builds that conversation, which is really, really nice. The other thing I was really nervous about starting a Facebook group, while I have you know, an email list, I have a good amount of people and a Face(book) and Instagram, I was like, ‘Oh, my gosh, I’m going to start this Facebook group, and nobody’s going to join.’ And it’s so funny that like 14 years into my business, you can still have glimpses of imposter syndrome, and whatever. So it’s really this work in progress as a self employed person. I think that, you know, we always want to make things better do better but we we can be nervous too.
Sandra Henderson 26:09
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, we pour so much of ourselves, even with having boundaries and things like that, like our emotions, and our lives are tied to what we do. So I, I don’t… I’m not hopeful that impostor syndrome will ever go away completely, but I think we learn better techniques to cope with it and deal with it when it does pop up. And I’m so flattered that you said I was inspiration for your Facebook group, because I actually, I have a business coach as well. And when I first started working with her was like, kind of like brainstorming and doing research on the industry and things like that. And like, it’s so easy to also get caught up in like… I’m a total believer of the community over competition mindset, but it’s so easy to kind of flip that when you get lost in your own little bubble, and you’re scrolling on Instagram, and like, even when you’re trying not to, you’re still comparing yourself as you’re scrolling. And so like, when I was looking at my competition in the area, you were the number one person that I had on my list, because I love your photos and I knew that you were also getting an education. And so then like when we started connecting again and talking more, and it just like instantly reminded me of why like it’s easy to get lost in there, but why it’s so important to focus on like the community side of things. So I’m so glad that we’ve been able to connect, and I look forward to being in your Facebook group. And I love like, all the photographers that are in there seems so awesome, and like totally all about that community side of things, too, which I think is so great.
Nova Markina 27:37
I could – I could not agree more.
Sandra Henderson 27:38
Well, is there anything else that you wanted to add in or chat about before we wrap things up?
Nova Markina 27:43
No, I-I, I really love this conversation we had and I think that we are so similar in the way we choose to run our businesses that I think it was a nice easy conversation. But yes, if you want to talk about any more of the topics that we touched on, I am totally here for it.
Sandra Henderson 28:02
Awesome. I will absolutely be in touch and then hopefully we’ll be able to maybe do a podcast episode from the beaches of Mexico one day, that would be lovely!
Nova Markina 28:11
Ooh okay! Yes, let’s put that, let’s put that on the vision board. We’ll just we’ll be sipping maybe margaritas, maybe some…
Sandra Henderson 28:18
Some green juice! From your stories today, green juice.
Nova Markina 28:24
Yes! That’s saved in my highlights, so once people listen to the podcast, are like “what are you talking about with the green juice?!” We’ll set some green juice in Mexico and do another podcast.
Sandra Henderson 28:33
Yeah, absolutely. That sounds great. Well, thank you so much again. Oh, actually, wait, before I say that, um, where do we find your Facebook group on Facebook?
Nova Markina 28:41
Oh, yes. So I am new to this. But I did create a URL for the Facebook group. So it is facebook.com/groups/NovaMarkinaMentoring. So if you’re a photographer, I would love to see you there. We can just build that community like you said, and yeah!
Join the Nova Markina Mentoring Facebook Community!
CLICK HERE
Sandra Henderson 28:59
Yes! Awesome! Definitely come and join us in the group! All right. Well, thank you so so much again. It was so great chatting with you. I loved this conversation too, and yeah, we’ll definitely we’ll make Mexico top of our to do list for next time!
Nova Markina 29:11
Love it. Thanks, Sandra! Thanks for having me!
–
Sandra Henderson 29:14
(Outro music) Thank you so much for listening. You can find full show notes from today’s episode at https://simplysandrayvonne.ca/keepingitcandid. In the meantime, let’s connect! You can find me on Instagram and Tiktok just search @simplysandrayvonne. And if you’re loving this podcast, I’d be so honored if you’d go ahead and hit that subscribe button and leave a review. Until next time! (Music fades out)
About Nova
Nova is a six-figure wedding photographer who spends her summers photographing the most luxurious weddings for her dream clients and the winters soaking up the sun while traveling and exploring the world with her family.
She’s an expert at helping other photographers reach their full potential, fill their calendars with the dreamiest clients, and charge the premium prices their worth!
(Intro Music)
Welcome to Keeping it Candid – Wedding Photography Unfiltered for photographers who want to keep it real. I’m your host, Sandra Henderson, international wedding and family photographer and educator with a Marie Kondo-style approach to running a business – you know, keeping things simple and getting rid of anything that doesn’t bring you joy!
More importantly, I’m a strong enneagram 3w2 who is obsessed with tacos, and my love for travelling plus navigating chronic illness life are just two of the many things that drive my passion for all things systems, workflows, and beating burnout as a business owner.
Join me twice a month for a candid, behind-the-scenes look at what it’s really like working as a wedding photographer – where I’ll give you actionable steps to take your business to the next level. Absolutely no fluff here, friends! So grab your favourite notebook and pen, and let’s dive into this week’s episode.
Sandra Henderson 0:56
Hey friends, and welcome back to our second last episode of the year!
Sandra Henderson 1:00
Today I am joined by Julie Painter Fried also known as Dallas Girl Friday. Julie is a Client Experience Architect and Operations Manager helping wedding pros organize and streamline their systems so they can continue to thrive doing what they love the most. She worked as a wedding planner for 10 years before transitioning into this role, and it gives her a unique perspective at what it takes to run a business in the wedding industry.
Sandra Henderson 1:22
During our chat we talked all about the importance of having standard operating procedures, the long term impacts of getting your systems in order and how to know when it’s time to hire a VA. Plus, Julie shared some amazing takeaways that you could literally start applying to your business today. Are you guys ready to dive in?
Adventures Behind The Lens
A limited email series where I’m spilling all the tea from the ups and downs I’ve experienced during my time in the wedding photography industry. Click here to join!
Sandra Henderson 1:40
Thank you so much for joining me Julie. I’m so excited for our chat today. Before we get started, why don’t you take a quick second if you don’t mind and just introduce yourself and let everybody know a little bit about you.
Julie Painter Fried 1:51
Hey, y’all, I’m Julie. I’m the girl Friday behind Dallas Girl Friday. And I am a client experience architect and Operations Manager for wedding professionals. I was a wedding planner for a decade. And then I shifted over into doing VA work and then I niched down to only working with wedding pros, because that’s who I liked, and it’s what I knew. And now I work exclusively with wedding pros. I love it. I love love, love it. And that could be anyone from planner to venue to band, hair and makeup artists, photographers, all of the things. If you are wedding related I’m your girl. For systems, not for I don’t know, Cat Training. I love systems they are, they are my love language. And right now I work with clients on like, a retainer basis as their COO, and I do systems audits and systems overhauls. And I am going to be hiring some people soon to be like, associate VAs for my, my company. Um, and so I’ll be able to take on more people because sometimes I know I have like people come to me and they’re like, Oh, but I only need this and this. And I’m like, Oh, I’m not the person for you. But I want to be. So I’m very excited about that direction.
Sandra Henderson 3:22
Yeah, that’ll be amazing. I’m excited to see how that goes for you.
Julie Painter Fried 3:27
The hope is to be hiring it by January.
Sandra Henderson 3:33
Right on! What a good way to start the new year. So as a systems expert, what state of mind do you find that most of your clients in the wedding industry are kind of res- like, residing in, when they first come to you for help with their systems?
Julie Painter Fried 3:49
Oh, they’re drowning. They’re underwater with like one slight fingernail sticking out. And that’s something I really attempt to educate and encourage people on is to hire before you’re ready. Because a VA or you know, systems, you know, me doing systems overhauls and audits, yeah, that’s different. But if you’re wanting to work with someone long term and just bring someone on to outsource a few things, maybe you’re blogging or culling images or managing your inbox and things like that. I just really try to encourage people to hire before they’re ready. Because if you are already missing deadlines, constantly bringing a new completely new person into your business won’t rescue you. They need time to learn your business and the weddings that are currently on the books along with your processes. So especially because weddings are a cyclical industry, I do say you know try to set yourself up for success by hiring during offseason, you know. Try not to bring someone on in the middle of October, I think that’s kind of just a universally busy month, no matter what part of the country you’re in. So you know, bring them in during your quote/unquote offseason, your slower season, and let someone learn your process and adjust to how you work. Because hiring in a rush usually means that the wrong person gets hired. And you’re, you’re more likely to overlook red flags if you’re panic hiring.
Sandra Henderson 5:28
Yeah, that’s so true or not having the time available that you need… Speaking of someone who needs Cat Training, she is looking for all kinds of attention. But when you’re in that –
Julie Painter Fried 5:38
You’ve got a mascot, I love it.
Sandra Henderson 5:41
Yeah haha. When you’re in that headspace, and you’re trying to bring someone on when you’re so overwhelmed, and you have all this work to do, and it’s your peak busy season, there is a portion of the work that you have to do to be able to have, like, bring that person on to help you. And so if you don’t have the capacity to do that, it’s so easy, I found in my own experience, for little things to get missed. And then it’s sort of like, the whole experience leaves a bad taste in your mouth. And I had to get myself out of the thought process of it wasn’t the outsourcing or the helping that was the issue, it was that I didn’t have any of the systems or processes needed in place to be able to bring someone on.
Julie Painter Fried 6:18
Oh my gosh, completely. I know that, because I’ve been doing, you know, in some different capacity, VA work now for almost eight years. And so I know that I have at times been that person that somebody has left working with me being like, Well, that was a terrible experience, because she didn’t know what she was doing. She didn’t know I was like, okay, but you gave me one month, and I didn’t come in with any SOPs. And I didn’t know how to do this. So I like to attempt to try to tell people like, Here are some ways you can effectively work with a VA and, you know, things like that. And like, yeah, there’s going to be some duds out there. Of course there are. But a lot of times it is just because things maybe aren’t set up in your business.
Julie Painter Fried 7:04
And so anyone listening right now, if you do not have SOPs in your business, which SOP is a standard operating procedure. It’s like a document that outlines the necessary steps to perform specific tasks for your business. So the aim with SOPs is to streamline your processes so that they’re clear, they’re concise, and this really will allow you to deliver like consistent and predictable results. To put it simply, think of them as like how to guides and checklists for all your recurring procedures and processes. So if you are listening to this, please go complete one SOP today, even if it’s this is how I change out a graphic in Canva. Or this is how I outline a blog post, you know, complete from click New Post in WordPress to like this is what I enter for SEO, you know, all of those kinds of things. It’s really good for all of that stuff just to be outlined, because I mean, you still can’t just hand those documents to someone and expect them to know what you, everything that’s going on in your business. There’s still a learning curve, still a training, but that will certainly set you up for success.
Sandra Henderson 8:24
Oh, absolutely. That was a quarantine project that I had over 2020 times when I wasn’t able to work was just to kind of like sit down and think about all the ways that I actually do things. And it’s been so helpful. I haven’t thankfully *knock on wood* had to like fully hand off things, but as someone navigating a chronic illness, there’s times that I’m just not able to be at my computer or doing things and so having those standard operating procedures even just kind of takes the the forethought away from my mind. Like if I can just easily refer to something I don’t have to think about it or having all these things on my mind all the time.
Julie Painter Fried 9:02
I completely get that from all angles because I have chronic illness too. I have chronic migraines have suffered from them my whole life.
Sandra Henderson 9:14
Same here!
Julie Painter Fried 9:15
You know, I do Botox in my skull and like it’s I do all the things. But I mean, there’s still taste when I am just knocked on my behind. And if I didn’t have processes in place, if I didn’t have things outlined that, that I could do, like I just my business would collapse. And I feel like you can’t save it if you’re already drowning. So why don’t you set yourself up for the best possible scenario because I mean, cars get into accidents. Babies come early. It could be something joyful, like you’re going on a honeymoon. Like there are going to be times when you do not want to be in your business and systems make it so that you don’t have to be all the time.
Sandra Henderson 10:03
Yes, I love that that’s such a good way to put it. So going off of that, what sort of impact kind of like short term and long term Do you see? Either in your own business or for the clients that you’re helping when you’re building out systems with them? What kind of impact are you seeing happen in their businesses, once things do start getting organized and more streamlined?
Julie Painter Fried 10:24
Oh, my gosh. So I will say short term, a thing a lot of people come to me with is and I love that you started working on your SOPs, like during that, you know, quote, unquote, COVID downtime, because a lot of people did. And that’s great. And a lot of people came to me and some people, you know, walked me through their stuff. And I set up their SOPs and outline for them, that is something I provide. But people, you will feel like, at first, it’s taking too long. I mean, because you have to write out every single thing. And that feels daunting. If it feels you know, the writer staring at the blank page feels daunting, what comes next? You’re gonna wish you could have it done in a snap, but I mean, long term, there is truly not a value that can be placed on it. I mean, having great systems in your business, not- it can mean exorbitantly more money. Who doesn’t want more money? More time with your family? A lot of people you know, in the wedding industry are you know, I won’t generalize it and say it’s just women, because it’s certainly not, but there are a lot of, you know, moms with young kids and things like that. And they want to have time to go be room mom and go volunteer at their kids school and be home, like after school for snack time. And all those things and systems can give you that time back. I mean, money can barely even buy you time, but systems can do it. More time to travel or pursue your outside interests, if you know, weddings, and the creative industry isn’t your only interest. So I mean, I truly, I can’t put a value on what it can do for you in the long term to be streamlined.
Sandra Henderson 12:18
Oh, absolutely. I think you said it perfectly. And it also gives you the ability to take that time, guilt free, you don’t have to worry and have like the weight of all the things that you quote unquote, should be doing or need to be doing. Because the systems and processes are in place that they more often than not, are running well and efficiently without you.
Julie Painter Fried 12:40
Yeah, absolutely.
Sandra Henderson 12:43
So what would you say if you could pick one reason why a wedding professional should get their systems in order? Do you think that you could pick just one?
Julie Painter Fried 12:53
Yes.
Sandra Henderson 12:54
What would that be?
Julie Painter Fried 12:56
Well, I mean, it’s one in that it’s a phrase, it encompasses a lot of things, but your client experience because we are in the business of hopefully only doing things once. You know, we’re- I mean, obviously, you know, divorce has happened and things happen and people do get married multiple times. But the, you know, hope when we send all those couples down the aisle is like, this is your forever person. One and done, I hope that I don’t see you again, kind of thing. But it’s also an issue where they’ve waited, you know, let’s say, you know, the average, couples getting married at age like 30ish. You know, that’s not their whole life, of course, but they’ve waited their whole life to find this person to have this day, that is still a huge thing for a lot of people. And so, I mean, they’re going to do it the one time, they want it to be perfect. If it’s not… We are not, let’s say AT&T. Like, for me, I have been with AT&T for 10 years. And granted, there have been times where they have messed up or service has gone out or they have sent me the wrong replacement product and things and okay, here’s a $15 credit on your bill. Okay, that was nice. But overall, like, does AT&T have five star customer service every time? No. Am I still with them? Yeah, ’cause it’s TV and let’s face it, I’m not giving up Bravo. But these people, this is their one time doing it. This is their one experience with you. And so the client experience which is, I mean, from the minute they land on your website until after their wedding when you’ve given them their deliverables, whether it’s you know, photos, videos, or just a tangible Thank you, that entire process is the client experience. And you can truly elevate that into a luxury space with systems to make every person feel like they are staying at, you know, the Ritz.
Sandra Henderson 15:21
Yeah, absolutely. And creating that just consistent client experience across the board adds to that luxury vibe as well. And I think those are the things especially speaking from a photographer’s perspective, a lot of people can take great photos. And it’s not to dismiss it, but I think that when it comes to running a successful photography business, and continuing to get your name out there and grow your business, has a lot more to do with the way that you’re running your company and the client experience that you’re providing, because there are so many people who are out there taking beautiful photos, but there’s not a lot of people out there who are delivering amazing client experiences.
Julie Painter Fried 16:01
Yeah. And I mean, you said it perfectly. It’s a photography business, you have to be running that business, too. And if that is not where your heart is that that is not where your mind is that that’s fine. Hire people who that is their strength. Hire people like me who nerd out on that stuff, like hardcore nerd out on systems. Because, yeah, you may take the best, most beautiful photographs in the world. And that’s your creative deliverable. But if you can’t email your client back in a timely manner, if you can’t outline the process of like, here’s when you’re going to schedule your engagement session here is when your photos will be delivered here is this and this and this, then you’re just making them wait around and wonder what’s coming next. They don’t know. You may have shot 100 weddings in the last two years. But they’ve only gotten married once. Probably.
Sandra Henderson 16:59
Yeah, that’s so important to remember.
Julie Painter Fried 17:01
Yeah. And it can be, you know, frustrating, I get, to feel like, oh, my gosh, these people are asking the same questions over and over and over, and it’s so annoying. Okay, then you need to beef up your onboarding packet with a list of FAQs that you know people are always asking, so you can answer this question before they even think of it.
Sandra Henderson 17:20
Exactly.
Julie Painter Fried 17:21
That is the client experience, because customer service is taking care of what went wrong. Client Experience is preventing it.
Sandra Henderson 17:28
I love the way that you phrase that that’s such a good perspective about it.
Julie Painter Fried 17:28
Thanks.
Sandra Henderson 17:29
Okay, so we’ve talked about creating those standard operating procedures and how important it is to get these systems and procedures all in place so that your business is running no matter what comes your way. Do you have any tips for someone who is just getting started? Whether they’re new in business, or they are, you know, like you were saying at the beginning, feeling like they’re drowning, and just have one fingertip sticking out of the water? Where would you say if someone was to dedicate an hour of their time today to getting started? What would be your recommendation?
Julie Painter Fried 18:07
Contact me?! No, I’m just kidding. Of course, but no, really the- I have, I would say start with one thing you think you could outsource. Whether it is, you know, a lot of people say, you know, blogging is such a time suck. Social media is such a time suck. Okay, what aspect of those things – something that you hate doing that you know you need in your business, but that your hands do not need to be touching – could you hand off? Just think of one thing. And then write that SOP down.
Sandra Henderson 18:41
Love that. That’s so good. I was thinking about that, as you were like originally talking about SOPs earlier, is that on a day where you’re not overwhelmed, you know, going into August, September for a lot of photographers and wedding professionals in general, this may not be the time but when you have a little bit more wiggle room to your schedule in a day, after you’ve done something, take five minutes and go write it down. And then eventually you’re going to be piecing together this SOP guide without having to sit there for six hours and write down every single detail.
Julie Painter Fried 19:15
Something I suggest to people too, who’re like, well, it takes too long right SOP and I don’t understand why I really need it. Or like Can’t you just do it for me? So if you don’t want to go back and forth into a Google doc – because SOPs do not need to be pretty. This is not some like gorgeous, like, Adobe Illustrator template that you’re working with. I mean, it’s just a basic Google Doc. But if this is something that is just causing you so much dread and you’re like it’s kind of taking more time. Just use a program like loom or Screencastify or something like that and just record yourself doing the thing, like and then send it to someone like me who can interpret what you have just done into an SOP for you. Um, and then you can even include the link to that Loom video as part of your SOP so people have a visual reference to what you’re doing so it’s not just a bunch of words.
Sandra Henderson 20:13
That’s such a good idea. I love that. Awesome. Well, do you have any final thoughts or anything before we wrap things up?
Julie Painter Fried 20:20
Um, I mean, I just – My biggest thing that I stress to people is that systems are not optional. I mean, they weren’t optional before COVID. And they certainly still are not optional. like stuff happens, and you have to be prepared and systems can save you time. They are your toolbox to utilize and improve every aspect of your business, in your life. Systems help you grow. And, you know, systems can literally save you. So, I mean, it’s something I’m so passionate about is systems are not optional. But you know, hop on my, hop on my website, schedule a discovery call. If you feel like maybe you need a systems audit, and you just need some eyes on it. Or if you need a systems overhaul, and you need me to come in and redo your CRM, write your canned emails, redo your processes. That’s something I offer. And then you know, come next year, you have some openings for additional VA services! can’t wait!
Julie Painter Fried 20:42
Yes. Love it. Yeah, that’s so so true about how just everything I think comes down to systems. I totally agree with you on that.
Julie Painter Fried 21:37
Everything. And it’s not a sexy topic. Like it’s not like, ooh, new Instagram, ooh, marketing. Ooh, selling. Like, it’s, it’s boring. I’m not, I’m not going to pretend it’s like glamorous. But to people like me who love it. It is glamorous. Like, I love what I do every day. And there are a lot of people, especially in this creative industry whose brains just don’t work like mine. And that’s great, because we need creatives to win the greatest. And we need… we need the visionaries, and we need the integrators on the ladder. So let, let me or someone like me, you know, come in and really just clean things up.
Sandra Henderson 22:18
Exactly. And then the people who aren’t systems focused, they can reap the glamorous benefits after when they get that freedom back.
Julie Painter Fried 22:26
And they can focus on what they actually love doing.
Sandra Henderson 22:28
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that’s so true.
Julie Painter Fried 22:31
Because if I mean, if you’re a photographer, and you hate that business-y part but you don’t take it off your plate, you are going to grow to resent your business. Every time you have to sit down to blog, every time you have to look at your numbers, every time you have to look at, you know, your back end and send emails. I mean, you’re gonna resent your business and you’re gonna burn out.
Sandra Henderson 22:50
Totally. That’s so so true. I have been there and I hope to never revisit that space ever again.
Julie Painter Fried 22:56
I yeah, I feel like most of us have, at some point for sure.
Sandra Henderson 22:59
Right? That’s a huge like goal of mine, or hope that I hope… or things that I hope people will take away from this podcast. Like the Keeping It Candid podcast as a whole, but even this specifically from this interview is just the like, the freedom that can come from taking these steps behind the scenes and that like the importance of getting ahead of it and not getting to it once you’ve burnt yourself out. I think that people who have been in the industry for a while we started our businesses with the hustle culture. And so it was very common for everybody to be burning out at the end of every year. And I hope to see a shift in that with the new generation of people coming into the wedding industry where they set those boundaries and set those systems ahead of time.
Julie Painter Fried 23:44
I hope so. Because burning out is not a badge of honor.
Sandra Henderson 23:48
No, not even a little bit. All right. Well, thank you so much again, before we end the call, I would love to just have you let everybody know where they can find you online and on social media.
Julie Painter Fried 24:00
Yes, you can find me at dallasgirlfriday.com. And then on social media, the only thing I do is Instagram, qnd if you want systems tips or hot takes on The Bachelor and book reviews and just me being a stone cold weirdo. Please come hang out with me on Instagram at @dallasgirlfriday.
Sandra Henderson 24:25
I love that. That was the best description. I love a stone cold weirdo!
Julie Painter Fried 24:30
I you know I learned a long time ago that that I’m not everyone’s cup of tea and that is completely fine. And I don’t want to be
Sandra Henderson 24:40
right. Exactly. Life is too short to take it all seriously.
Julie Painter Fried 24:45
If people come to my Instagram and they like what they’re seeing, they know that’s what they’re gonna get when they work with me. And if you don’t like what you’re seeing, happy to recommend someone else.
Sandra Henderson 24:56
There’s lots of people on this world, the world takes all kinds, and so we can easily just bring in those people that fit our vibe and everyone else can go find their vibe. It’s totally fine.
Julie Painter Fried 25:05
100% Yeah.
Sandra Henderson 25:08
Awesome. Well, thank you so much again, Julie, this was great. And I cannot wait to connect with you again down the road.
Sandra Henderson 25:15
Okay, you guys know that I am obsessed with systems so it’s probably no surprise to you that I absolutely loved this conversation with Julie. Whether you’re building them out yourself or hiring someone to do it for you, systems are truly a non-negotiable when it comes to a successful, thriving business.
Sandra Henderson 25:31
And I remember years ago, I was talking to one of my old college professors about how I planned on learning how to do my taxes myself. My mom had always done them for me up until that point, that’s one of the perks of having a mom who’s bookkeeper! But mixing business and family can get stressful, let’s be honest, so I wanted to make a change. I also felt like it was like the quote/unquote “adult” thing to do.
And when I told my prof this, I will literally never forget his response. He said, ‘You know how people say they’re going to just get their uncle with a nice camera to take their wedding photos. Like, sure, you can absolutely do that. But should you? probably not. And the same goes for your taxes. Just because you can do them yourself doesn’t mean that you should do them yourself.
And that lesson has really stuck with me through so many different aspects of running a business. As entrepreneurs, we’re used to wearing all the hats. We’re emotionally invested in every aspect of our businesses. And it’s hard to let go of any of the things that we’ve worked so hard to build, we get lost in the thought of if I want it done right, I have to do it myself.
But here’s the thing, we can only excel in so many different things right? It’s impossible for us to do every single thing at an expert level. If every person and every business in the world could excel at their own finances and taxes, we would have no need for accountants. If every person in the world could take technically perfect photos and capture the best emotions with their cell phones and personal cameras, we would have no need for photographers. And if everyone could prepare the most unbelievable meals from scratch with no effort, we would probably spend a lot less time at restaurants.
But we live in a world full of people who are experts in their field and it’s a smart business decision, not a lazy or irresponsible one, to outsource different aspects of your work and work with other professionals who excel in the areas outside of your own expertise.
I hope this episode has inspired you to take some of the hats off that you wear every day. Whether you start by writing out one standard operating procedure like Julie’s suggested, or if you’re ready to take the leap to hiring a VA or working with a systems expert. You deserve to take some of the things off your plate.
Now before I go – Have I ever told you about how I found out my foot was broken while I was shooting a wedding?! If you want to hear the story join me for an Adventure Behind the Lens, a limited email series where I’m spilling the tea about all the ups and downs I’ve been through over the last 12 years in the wedding industry.
Head to simplysandrayvonne.ca/adventures to join!
(Outro Music)
Thanks so much for listening to Keeping It Candid: Wedding Photography Unfiltered with Sandra Henderson! You can find full show notes from today’s episode at simplysandrayvonne.ca/keepingitcandid. In the meantime – let’s connect! You can find me on Instagram @simplysandrayvonne, and on Facebook in the Wedding Photography Unfiltered community! If you’re loving this podcast, I’d be so honoured if you’d go ahead and hit that subscribe button and leave me a review!
Until next time!
Julie Painter Fried from Dallas Girl Friday
Website | www.dallasgirlfriday.com
IG | @dallasgirlfriday
About Julie
Julie is a Dallas native who planned weddings for a decade before transitioning into working with wedding pros to transform their systems and client experience. Julie is a newlywed, a lover of reality tv, and you can find her on Instagram reviewing books and chatting systems.
(Intro Music)
Welcome to Keeping it Candid – Wedding Photography Unfiltered for photographers who want to keep it real. I’m your host, Sandra Henderson, international wedding and family photographer and educator with a Marie Kondo-style approach to running a business – you know, keeping things simple and getting rid of anything that doesn’t bring you joy!
More importantly, I’m a strong enneagram 3w2 who is obsessed with tacos, and my love for travelling plus navigating chronic illness life are just two of the many things that drive my passion for all things systems, workflows, and beating burnout as a business owner.
Join me twice a month for a candid, behind-the-scenes look at what it’s really like working as a wedding photographer – where I’ll give you actionable steps to take your business to the next level. Absolutely no fluff here, friends! So grab your favourite notebook and pen, and let’s dive into this week’s episode.
Sandra Henderson 00:56
Welcome Friends! We are back for day two of the local vendor series. If you’re tuning in for the first time and aren’t sure what this series is all about – let me give you a quick little summary. I connected with different vendors local to the London, Ontario area that I’ve had a chance to work with over the last few years, and we talked about things like why it’s so important to create that dream team vibe of vendors on a wedding day, how we can support and serve one another and some of the dos and don’ts that we’ve come across during our time in the industry. I hope that by starting these conversations, we can finally be done with the idea that other vendors are out to get us with negative intentions and ulterior motives on a wedding day and hopefully start creating a stronger community of people who are ready to support one another and show up to serve their couples in the best way possible. Today I’m joined by my friend Ally, who is the owner and lead wedding planner at Perfectly Designed Events. She specializes in full-service wedding and event planning to allow her clients to have the most seamless experience possible. And in the short time that I’ve known Ally, we’ve had the chance to work together a few times and I can tell you firsthand that she is amazing at what she does. Her passion for serving her clients and the vendors on a wedding day shows in every aspect, so I knew that she would be a perfect fit for this episode.
Sandra Henderson 02:09
For some context, these interviews were recorded a while ago, like back when I first launched the podcast earlier this year! I actually plan on only doing one episode on this topic, but after I started having conversations with different vendors, I realized that it was just too good to condense down into one single episode. And so, The Local Vendor Series was born! At the beginning of Ally’s interview, we chat a bit about the podcast just launching. So I thought I would clear up any confusion before we get started.
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Sandra Henderson 02:38
Thank you for being my very first interview for the podcast. I’m so excited!
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 02:43
Oh my gosh, I’m so excited! I didn’t know I was the first!
Sandra Henderson 02:47
Yes, you’re my very first! I have a few others lined up for this episode and a couple others, but you are the first one. So thank you so much for being here!
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 02:55
Oh, my goodness. Well, thank you so much for reaching out to me. I’m looking forward to chatting with you. And congratulations on the podcast.
Sandra Henderson 03:01
Thank you! All right. So why don’t you tell me a little bit about yourself to get started?
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 03:07
Oh, absolutely. So my name is Ally. I specialize in full-service wedding and event planning in all of southwestern Ontario. So, I started planning events back in 2012. I lived in Edmonton, Alberta, and I started working for a kind of like a restaurant lounge that had a private loft space. So I started there as a host, and I kind of worked my way into an event coordination position. I absolutely loved it. So we did like a lot of book signings, we did Christmas parties, business dinners. It was a capacity of about 50, seated to 100 standing. So it was a lot of those more smaller business-related events. But I loved it. And then there was one time when we did one wedding, and it was fabulous. So I moved to London in kind of late 2013. And then I searched for a similar job and found out the hard way that that doesn’t really exist here. So I decided to get certified through the Wedding Planners Institute of Canada and I became a wedding planner technically in 2014. And I started I worked for a local day of coordinator in the area from 2014 until 2017. And then I decided to kind of branch out on my own and focus on full-service planning from start to finish. I really wanted to be a part of everybody’s you know, wedding day or event day, through the entire process and all of the booking, all the little details through the whole day. So I’ve been doing this now since kind of the end of the season of 2017.
Sandra Henderson 04:51
Oh, that’s awesome. That’s so cool that you got to do book signings and things like that that must have been so different from planning a wedding!
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 04:58
It really was honestly it was so different. And I actually I have this one book from a book signing that I remember so specifically, but all of the events that we did kind of back then, I suppose, 10 years ago now, they were so, so different. And every day was different. Weddings are different, too. But you know, they kind of tend to follow the same, the same structure. And I do I like that. And I, I thrive in the consistency, but also making it, you know, the personalized day that everyone’s looking for. But yeah, I really enjoyed those. We did like, Super Bowl parties. We did a, like, I can’t remember if it was the Bachelor or the Bachelorette. But we had like a viewing night in the loft. And we turned all the TVs on. We had red roses, we made a kind of very bachelor themed and so many, so many different types of events. It was a lot of fun.
Sandra Henderson 05:49
So do you ever- you were saying about 10 years now. Do you ever feel like it’s weird to think that you’ve been able to be doing something that you can look back on it that long? Like sometimes I don’t feel like I’m old enough to have been in business for nine years.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 06:02
Right? I know, that’s actually something I think about often. When people look at me, so I’m 28. And I started this when I was 18 years old. And people look at me and they think like, Oh, you must, must have just started. And I’m like no, I’m, I’m somehow 10 years into this. And yes, I started when I was 18 basically kind of Straight Outta straight out of high school and I fell in love with, I fell in love with it.
Sandra Henderson 06:29
That’s so awesome. I love that. So over the last 10 years, what has your experience looked like working with wedding photographers?
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 06:38
I would say pretty much entirely positive that the wedding industry as a whole in London and area, and Southwestern Ontario in general. I find everyone to be, for the most part, very accepting and, and helpful. And I’ve had a really good experience overall, I do tend to get along really well with people who are also in the creative industry and like the creative side of weddings. So I tend to you know, I tend to really enjoy working with the photographers who have crossed paths with they found, you know, pretty much everyone to be really interested in collaborating and working together. Again, I know we’ve talked about it before, Sandra, but for kind of the common, the common goal of having a couple have the best day possible.
Sandra Henderson 07:23
Yeah, absolutely. Which is the takeaway that I hope everybody gets from this episode. Do you have any situations you’ve come across where it was like, please do this if you’re a wedding photographer, or please absolutely do not ever do this again, to me as a wedding planner?!
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 07:41
Oh, that’s a tricky one. I mean, I would say that the biggest thing that we occasionally come across is just remembering to treat everybody with respect. And I think that goes for kind of every category of wedding professionals and guests and couples and everyone as well. We’re all humans. And again, we’re all just looking to make this couple’s wedding day, the absolute perfect day, you know, so for me, I’ve spent years and hundreds of hours working on every kind of like little tiny detail and 99 points percent of the time all of the other vendors are have also put in a ton of work and they’ve really invested into this day, we’re all trying to kind of get there there is that, you know, hand a handful of times where there’s event vendors, sometimes photographers, sometimes someone else who they’re, what’s the best way to say it, they sometimes I think maybe the appreciation of the amount of work that others are putting into it as well, isn’t always there. We always know how much we’re putting in, right? And as a planner, I typically know how much everyone else is putting into it because I’m a part of that. But not everyone else, kind of you know, there’s makeup artists don’t often chat with the florists and I mean, of course, they do have some relationships and but it’s just not on a regular kind of standard wedding day, you, unfortunately, not all vendors get to interact in that kind of way to really understand, like, how much work has gone into it. So honestly, I mean, treating people with respect and I think it all goes back to the Dream Team and, and being able to kind of like work together to make sure that we’re making the best day for our couples but yeah, treating, treating everybody with respect is key. And I think one of the things that if I were to say like there was a please don’t, it would probably just come it would stem from that point of treating everyone with respect as planners and I’ve talked to many other, many other planners, I’ve got great relationships with the other planners in the province. And I know that we all deal with this to a certain extent but our largest challenge is negativity and frustration coming from other vendors because not everybody is realizing how much we’re balancing to try to make this day happen. You know someone requests X amount of time for hair and makeup and two hours for couple portraits, but then also the caterer needs this amount of time and, but the venue doesn’t have staff until this time, and they have to close it this time. But if we’re too early, then we can’t get a bus for our guests, there’s so much to balance. And that’s, that’s the biggest challenge as a wedding planner is knowing that you can’t please everyone. And honestly, you really can’t ever please anyone. Because you need to, as a, as a professional, it’s, you have to try to bring all this together and kind of make everybody compromise for the sake of the couple and kind of getting everything coming together. But then you’re also the bearer of bad news at all times. So I’m kind of the bearer of bad news to photographers and florists and the couple as well and their families trying to explain what’s possible and what’s not and why And I mean, the pl- I suppose I would love for people to kind of really get a good understanding of why, why we do the things that we do. And same thing when it’s the couples who are working without a planner, understanding why they’re doing those things, too, and why they may not be able to give the amount of timing that’s required, or the exact layout that is preferred, or the seating or all of those kinds of logistics, you’re balancing 20 to 30, different vendors preferences, and you know, contracts and the frustration, I totally understand where it comes from. But it’s, I mean, I think just having the respect for the people who are planning those as well and the couples to again, when there’s no planner, it’s so important.
Sandra Henderson 11:34
That’s all so so true. I think it’s so important to just, for all wedding vendors across the board to realize nobody has any sort of negative intentions of the wedding day. No one is looking to screw another person over because we all have to work together. And so if, for, just for example, if you as the planner, were intentionally making it so that the photographer had less time, and you know, that was just like your priority, it was like, No, you can get it done, sorry about what your needs are, then your clients would not be happy with the vendor that you recommended for them. So like, it just doesn’t make sense to come into it thinking that you have no flexibility because, you know, this other person is just out to get you like, it’s definitely it’s such a huge puzzle with so many pieces like you were saying.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 12:25
Yeah, absolutely. And it’s so true. And I think it’s always just kind of taking that step back. And, you know, understanding why everyone wants what they’re asking for. And, you know, timing is I think probably the biggest challenge. Unfortunately, there’s just not enough hours in the day. And I have to, I’m trying to balance my clients’ wishes, you know, they don’t want to start before 8am. Well, that might not be awesome, because we need six hours plus for hair and makeup. But then we also need that time for capturing getting ready. And we need the detail time, then we need time for the first look and the ceremony, there’s just not enough hours in the day for everybody to be able to kind of get what they want. So I find so much of it is just kind of balancing, you know, the couple’s expectations, and then, you know, really trying to get to the bottom of which vendors need what and what we could kind of, you know how we could compromise to try to make it work for everyone, you know, can we add another stylist? Can we add a second shooter? Can we, you know, what can we do to try and make all of it, all of it work so that everyone is getting what they need? Because again, like you said, it’s all just to try to make this day the most perfect day for this couple. And I think that’s why the majority of us in the wedding industry have come here, like, we just we want to help people, we want to serve people and we want to see them happy on one of this, you know, these, this kind of greatest day of their lives.
Sandra Henderson 13:47
I love all of that. And it’s so so true. So let me jump into the next question that I have. When it comes to wedding photographers showing up on the wedding day, we often get a lot of requests from other vendors that we have great relationships with and things like that to be able to provide photos. I think that’s a huge, huge conversation that I’m planning on saving for a later episode. But basically, I want to know, when it comes to a wedding planner… unless like, as I’ve learned more about what a wedding planner does, I know that you put so much work into like the design of the tablescapes and things like that. But even if you’re working with a decorator, a lot of times a wedding planner is creatively having so much input in how the design of the day turns out, which I don’t think- I know I just learned that recently. And so I think that there’s probably a lot of vendors who don’t realize that as well. But outside of the like, decor side of the day, there’s a lot of parts of what your job is that are not able to necessarily be photographically represented. So I wanted to know how photographers can show up in a creative and photographic way to represent what you do and serve you as a wedding planner?
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 15:04
Absolutely. That’s a great question. I do think that that’s actually one of the reasons why wedding planners and decorators get confused So often. I have inquiries, probably twice a week, asking for me to do decor and I explained that I actually partner with a ton of great decorators in the area and a lot of my weddings, they have decorators, too. That’s not necessarily me. But what is normally me, is that initial vision. So typically, what I do with my clients, is we work through a design process together. And that’s before we hire a decorator, a florist, or rentals. That’s before all of that. So typically, what we would do is once we start to kind of get our other vendors in place – photography, video, catering, hair, makeup, all of those elements that aren’t necessarily directly related to the design of the day, then we’ll do a venue tour, we’ll go through everything that they’re looking for – kind of the theme, the style, any ideas that they have. And then I’ll put together a design plan. And that will include elements from rental companies, it will include elements from decorators, it will include elements for florists, I typically work with like four to five different rental companies and or decorators for each wedding. And I think that’s something that is, is really not realized at all by kind of those who are outside of this world of wedding – of being a wedding planner.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 16:25
But yeah, so I mean, I think that one of the biggest things is, we put so much energy in so much time and effort into the smallest details. It’s, It’s so true, like beyond, like we were talking already about timing, beyond that, when we kind of move into the design portion of the day, that’s the only place where a wedding planners work can really be captured. The rest of our work is kind of the whole wedding together. But the only place where you can really ever see it in a photo is through the design. And one of the things that that I find is a lot of photographers, they do understand that and they, they want to get those, they want to get those photos, they, you know, they asked me what I’m looking for. And honestly, for the most part, I’m not ever looking for anything super specific. Sometimes they have a vision of maybe the couple on the dance floor with the whole room in the background. But for the most part, it’s you know, just capture it capture the day as it is, and, but get those detail photos. And I find that those get forgotten often are kind of looked over. And I don’t know if everyone kind of actually realizes how much it matters to the clients as well.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 17:34
But you know, to give kind of a quick example, I’ve got an event coming up in May. And we have spent hundreds of dollars, hours, and probably three meetings talking about cocktail napkins. So what seems so small to kind of the outside eye like, to the guests are going to come they’re gonna see some cocktail napkins, it’s going to have their name on it, they’re gonna think, wow, those are really fun. But they don’t realize how much we went through to get there. The samples that we looked at, the multiple companies we talked to, looking at the, you know, font colors, purchasing the font we’re going to use, designing it, all of those little things for this one, well, hundreds, but one tiny little cocktail napkin. And so I find that when it comes down to it, my clients, they do want to see that reflected in their images at the end of the day. For myself, that’s totally something I’d love to see as well. I mean, if I’m, if the photographer is willing to share the gallery with me, those are things I love to see, because those cocktail napkins, they’ve got a great story behind them. Like 20-plus hours of work for this one little thing. But yeah, I think just capturing all of the day is how photographers can best kind of serve planners and represent our work. And again, visually, unfortunately, there really, the only thing we can show for it is all of those little details but we put so much energy and so much effort into you know, getting washroom trailers booked and finding all of the best vendors, and we talked to 40 different photographers meet with seven of them before our clients pick the best one, and kind of all of those little, all of those little details but none of that is, unfortunately, able to really be represented in the physical work that we can see after. so I do find that that’s possibly why some planners and some decorators and other vendors are really wanting to see like, specific elements of the decor, and I know that some photographers, some photographers who I’ve worked with they see that you know they see the need for the detail photos, but things like those napkins would absolutely be overlooked. They, you know, they take a few – and I’ve definitely gotten some galleries back before where there’s three detail photos and, you know, at the end of the day, it is what it is but I would love for people to know also that the couples want that as well. And they may not know it at the beginning, or they may not know it when they kind of first book you and you have that conversation about what they want to see in their gallery. But once they go through it all, and you know, this client, for example, who’s had to talk to me about cocktail napkins for six months, I know that when she flips through her gallery and sees a quick snap of those cocktail napkins, she’s gonna have a little giggle, and it’s just all of those memories, and all of the little things that kind of bring everything together.
Sandra Henderson 20:20
Absolutely. That’s such a great point about like, the memories leading up to the wedding day, I think like as someone who for the most part, planned my own wedding and worked with a day of coordinator, all of that, like all of what I remember is all the negative, like the stress and everything that went wrong, but when you have the little, the photos that will remind you of the, you know, the fun parts of the planning process – that’s so important, and something that you definitely don’t really think about in advance. And I think it really speaks to what you were saying before as well about just kind of like respecting that everybody had put so much work into it and unless you’re in the industry, yourself, you don’t necessarily know everything that’s going into it. So yeah, I think that’s a great way that photographers can show up and start, you know, not to say start being a part of the dream team, but like, just be a part of the dream team. Because, you know, we have so many people, it definitely is going to take effort from everybody. But speaking of the dream teams, what impact would you say it has for you and your clients and their overall experience when they do have a dream team of vendors that have worked together before and, you know, have a really great relationship outside of the wedding day as well?
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 21:32
Oh, my goodness, it feels amazing! It’s it, it leads honestly, to truly a flawless day. Because when you’ve worked together, and when you, you know, when you’re comfortable with each other, and you know each other and you know, I know how you’re going to act, you know how I’m going to act in any kind of issues that arise, because there will always be an issue, we’re able to easily and efficiently solve those problems. So on my end, it makes my day, so much smoother, I can focus a little bit more on the guests, I can focus more on the couple, I can focus more on the smaller details instead of trying to, you know, understand what everyone else is thinking and making sure that they have what they need. Because I know what, you know, I know what you need. So it’s honestly for myself, it’s so important. And it’s amazing to have that dream team come together and have everyone, again, respect each other’s work and what everyone has put into the day.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 22:30
And then for the couple and for the family. Again, it just leads to a flawless day when you have the best, the best team around you, and a team that is excited to work together and they’re positive and they’re happy. It’s, It’s everybody’s favorite day, the vendors are having a great time, the guests are having a great time. And they can see that, you know, like the photographers happy, the planners happy, like everyone looks calm, everyone’s working together. And that’s how I feel that it should be for everybody, just again, like, you know, respecting each other and working together and compromising and just kind of making the day the best day that it can be for the couple.
Sandra Henderson 23:10
I love that so much. I love all of your answers. We’re just on such like, the same mindset when it comes to how wedding day, like I hate using the word should, but how wedding day should come together, it shouldn’t be a place where you know, people are competing for the same space or thinking that one priority is better than the other like, coming together with people, speaking from my own experience, that I have lots of experience working with, that I talked with outside of the wedding day. It just makes the day so much more enjoyable. But I realized recently how rare it actually is, it seems, because I was talking to a friend who, we were saying, like we both just booked the same client. And they seemed shocked that we not only knew each other but that we had such a great relationship outside of the wedding industry. And so it makes me think like, what are people seeing at the weddings that they’re attending as guests that this is such a surprising thing. So I hope to see more of this whole dream team vibe coming together as we continue on and what is hopefully going to start being more and more regular of wedding seasons compared to the last couple of years.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 24:17
Yes, oh my gosh, I hope so. But it’s so true. It’s when you have that great relationship. And when you’re comfortable working together, you’ve worked even if you haven’t worked together before, if you’ve communicated positively and you know, it just makes a whole day. Fantastic for the family, for the couple, for their friends. And it’s, it’s so true. I’d love to get to a place where that is just every event and there aren’t events where someone leaves feeling like they had to battle a different vendor all day and again for you know, for my team that that is rare, but I know that it’s happened before and I know that it happens to others, but you know getting to a point where we’re all working together and we can kind of put aside what We may, may need, I mean, not to the point where it affects our services, but to the point where it allows everybody to thrive together and not just, you know, not just one member. And that goes for us as well. Like, my team needs to always be aware that although we would love more time to move chairs And to do all of these little details, it doesn’t always work like that. Sometimes we have to start at 6am so that we can be done by one o’clock so that you can shoot it. And it’s, that’s just how it is. And, you know, we try our best to make sure that we remember that too and we can always be compromising so that everybody as a, as a whole can work together for the day to go as smoothly as possible.
Sandra Henderson 25:37
It’s so so important to stay flexible on a wedding day, I think regardless of what vendor you are, anything can happen. And so that’s a conversation that I have with my team as well. Like, you just kind of have to roll with the punches and like, don’t stress about anything that can happen.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 25:54
Yeah, absolutely. And there’s, something always goes wrong. I’ve never had a wedding day out of the many, many, many weddings I’ve done, I’ve never had a wedding day where I was like, wow, that was flawless, nothing went wrong. Something always goes wrong. And they mean, that’s why most people hire us, because they know that things will go wrong, and so they think I’ll get someone to help. And then they realize all of the other things that we can help with too, in relieving stress along the way, and on the wedding day, working with everybody to just kind of resolve it, and they never know. But yeah, it’s so important to be able to work together so that the day is positive and happy, and loving. And that’s how it should be.
Sandra Henderson 26:29
Absolutely. I remember when I was planning my wedding, I like, in hindsight, definitely should have hired a wedding planner. I did work with the day of coordinator and my parents, specifically, like, thought that it was just the most unnecessary out of this world expense. And I will even say like, I traded part of my, the cost of my coordinator for photography services. So like I wasn’t even paying full price. And they just thought it was the craziest thing – until after the wedding day. And then they both kind of were like, Okay, no, that was probably the best decision that you could have made. And I so so agree, having someone else that’s there that can handle any of those little hiccups that go wrong, because they do go wrong. And things like that. Like it just it makes the day so much more enjoyable From the couple’s perspective.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 27:17
Absolutely. And for your parents as well in the family, I get that often where you know, the maid of honor or the mom or whoever they’re kind of on the fence about a planner, normally about partway- halfway through the experience, when we’re talking about permits and licenses, that’s normally when it all turns around, and they’re like, whoa, we didn’t want to do that. But yeah, on the day itself, for those who do hire someone who is more of that, like day of, month of management planner, it’s just so important to have somebody there who is able to, to help you through all of that. And then also who’s able to work with your vendor team And make sure also that, again, everyone is compromising to make sure that we’re getting the best timing, and the best, the best shots and you know, getting it, getting it all organized together for the best day possible.
Sandra Henderson 28:08
Yeah, absolutely. So one last question that I had for you – when it comes to recommending wedding photographers to your clients, what are some things that you are looking for specifically, whether it be you know, the look of their portfolio that they have a certain number of, a certain number of years experience under their belt? working exclusively with people that you’ve worked with before? How does that look for you?
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 28:32
Yeah, absolutely. That’s a great question. So with every vendor, so I specialize in helping my clients find every single vendor. So with photography, specifically, we start with a document that runs them through basically just basic editing styles. So just to get an idea of what kind of style they’re looking for their images to look like at the end of the day, are we looking for something that’s light, and it’s timeless? And it’s classic? And that’s going to match what we’re thinking? Are we looking for something maybe a little bit more, a little bit moody or a little bit with deeper tones? Like what are we looking for? So we start there, we get a really good idea of what they’re wanting to see at the end of the day. And then I ask them to rank, there’s 14 different areas, I ask them to rank them one to 14, everything from like couples photos together to candid guest photos to candid photos of them, posed photos, detail shots, getting ready photos, and I ask them to rank them all so I can get a really good idea of what they would like to see. And it’s so interesting, and I got I brought it up a little bit earlier but it’s very interesting to see which ones come in higher, more often. And I I would actually say that it’s those getting-ready photos are normally in like the top five areas. And so I always make sure that, to leave enough time there and that’s not a place where we’re rushing or Make sure that we’re recommending a larger package, or I’m searching for someone where a large package is within our budget. But I get them to basically break all that down for me. So I can see what’s important again, like if getting ready is number one, and sunset is number two, then we’re going to be searching for a longer package. But if those things are both at the very, very bottom, and like the ceremony, the wedding party photos or those were at the top, then that’s different than we may do it a little bit differently. So that’s where I start. So I first get an idea of the, of the editing style that they feel that they’re looking for. And then they get an idea of the type of photos that they’re looking for, including like more post photos, more candid photos, so I can understand what style of editing and then what style of photography they’re looking for, at the end of the day. From there, Honestly, I look at personality and portfolio. And that’s really all that it is For me, I don’t really worry about the years of experience, that is not really ever something that honestly crosses my mind. Same thing, people I’ve worked with previously, the only reason why I would say that I do tend to work with, you know, certain photographers more consistently is just because I know their personality And I know that them as a human is going to be a great fit for our vendor team. And it’s going to be a great fit for that couple. If I have like a really shy, really quiet couple, they’re really timid, I’m probably not going to pair them with an also quieter, more timid photographer, probably going to get them someone who’s a little bit more in the middle who was able to direct the day, not aggressively, but someone who is able to kind of leave that day for them. So that they’re feeling comfortable through everything.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 31:37
So I mean, ultimately, we start by understanding the styles that they’re looking for, and then how much time we need. And then from there, we can understand who personality wise is going to be a good fit for them. And then again, typically, you know, pricing is what would come next. And then that would be based on the hours that were required, paired with style, paired with, you know, with everything else to kind of get them those best options. So typically, I reach out to about five vendors in every category to check for availability and pricing. And then typically, I will present two to three of each vendor to my clients so that they can really get a good idea of the options out there for them who I already feel are going to be the perfect fit personality-wise, they’re a great fit, you know, for them in terms of what they said they were looking for style-wise, and they fit with their budget. So basically, then it just comes down to who they feel is the best person for them. And we typically set up meetings where they’ll just they’ll talk and I sit back and I just listen. And you talk all about your process and what they’re looking for. And then we get to a point where they’re torn, because again, their search has been narrowed to three people who I don’t think they could really go wrong anyway. And then I tell them that it’s all just at that point, it’s kind of down to personality. And you know, everyone is beautiful, and everyone is wonderful. But it’s who do you want to spend those 10, eight to 10-plus hours with on your wedding day, like who do you feel comfortable with. And I want my couples to surround themselves with every vendor who will make them feel calm and relaxed, and you know, at peace and happy with their day.
Sandra Henderson 33:20
Yeah, that’s so important is having like your dream team of vendors being calm, cool, and collected through the whole day. So, so important. And I love how thorough your process is to recommend photographers to your clients. I saw a lot when I was, more when I was first starting out in the industry, that there was a lot of couples who would hire a photographer with the assumption that all you need to do is press a button and you can do whatever style I want from there. And you like, my I always go to like, food and restaurant examples When I talk about things like this as an analogy, when you go to McDonald’s, and you order a hamburger, you’re not going in expecting the quality of the Keg for like something that you would order there. And so you have to kind of like have an understanding when you’re searching for a wedding photographer that you want to look at the style that you want, and hire someone who already does that style and that thing that you’re looking for, as opposed to just hiring any photographer and getting a light and airy photographer when you really want dark and moody photos.
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 34:27
Yeah, exactly. And that’s why that’s kind of the place that I start. And I find, you know, some couples have an idea, but some couples really, they don’t know. And they’re kind of at the point where they’re just not even sure what direction to go in. And at that point We’ll talk them through that as well And we’ll, we’ll talk about you know what kind of photos they like to see, what photos do you hang in your house like, talk to us about that. And it is a very thorough process and it’s like that with every vendor, which I suppose is why it takes me so long to plan each wedding. But we want to make sure that they’re getting The right person the first time. it happened a lot through COVID, But even in regular times, we’ve had a lot of people who have hired us kind of partway through their process And they’ve, you know, maybe hired a handful of vendors, and they get there And they think we hired this person because they did our friend’s wedding, or we hired this person ’cause we saw them on social media And we thought it looks good So we just did it. But we’re kind of getting into it now And we’re understanding that maybe that’s not what we’re looking for, again, because they thought you could just kind of, you know, point, shoot, and away it goes. And that’s definitely a large misconception. I think we’re getting a little bit better or getting a little bit away from that. But, hopefully, but yeah, it’s so important to me that we’re finding the right person the first time and that there’s never a moment where any of my couples are feeling any kind of like regret or they’re second-guessing, or they’re worried about the wedding day And it’s you know, I’m, I’m the first person to say that not everyone is the best fit for everybody. Like, I know that there are many couples out there and our personality, or personalities, where it just might not mesh together. And that’s okay because there’s going to be a wedding planner for you. I know there is, I will help you find them. But it’s you know, it’s so important to just make sure you’re getting those right people. And so for me as the planner, it’s extra-extra important to make sure my clients are getting those right people right from the beginning.
Sandra Henderson 36:24
Yeah, exactly. So so true. So important. I love that. All right. Well, that wraps up everything that I have. Thank you so much. That was absolutely amazing. And I just want to ask before we wrap things up, where does everybody find you on social media?
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson 36:39
Yes, absolutely. So @perfectlydesignedevents. I am on, primarily most active on Instagram, you can also find me on my website perfectlydesignedevents.com. Through there you can see all of my portfolio on there as well as the different services that we offer. And again, we focus on full-service wedding and event planning. So we aim to be a part of the process kind of from the very, very beginning, all the way to the end. And within that, we have customized packages to make it kind of work best for our couples in their budget, but our goal is to be there the whole way.
Sandra Henderson 37:15
Amazing.
Sandra Henderson 37:16
Okay, before I wrap up today’s episode, if you’re listening to this in real-time, you know it is Black Friday week! make sure you’re following me on Instagram all week long, And if you are not that’s @simplysandrayvonne because I am sharing discounts on all of my favourite business systems and services. contracts from the legal Paige, website templates from the Tonic Site Shop, gallery sites, CRMs, and so much more. If your business needs a little TLC over your off-season this year, now is the perfect chance to take advantage of all the savings available.
(Outro Music)
Thanks so much for listening to Keeping It Candid: Wedding Photography Unfiltered with Sandra Henderson! You can find full show notes from today’s episode at simplysandrayvonne.ca/keepingitcandid. In the meantime – let’s connect! You can find me on Instagram @simplysandrayvonne, and on Facebook in the Wedding Photography Unfiltered community! If you’re loving this podcast, I’d be so honoured if you’d go ahead and hit that subscribe button and leave me a review!
Until next time!
Ally Lightfoot-Atkinson from Perfectly Designed Events
Website | https://www.perfectlydesignedevents.com
IG | @perfectlydesignedevents
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About Ally
Ally is the Owner & Lead Wedding Planner at Perfectly Designed Events, serving all of Southwestern Ontario. We specialize in full-service Wedding & Event Planning to allow our clients to have the most seamless experience possible, designing every little detail to ensure that your event is perfectly yours, and full of unforgettable moments.
(Intro Music)
Welcome to Keeping it Candid – Wedding Photography Unfiltered for photographers who want to keep it real. I’m your host, Sandra Henderson, international wedding and family photographer and educator with a Marie Kondo-style approach to running a business – you know, keeping things simple and getting rid of anything that doesn’t bring you joy!
More importantly, I’m a strong enneagram 3w2 who is obsessed with tacos, and my love for travelling plus navigating chronic illness life are just two of the many things that drive my passion for all things systems, workflows, and beating burnout as a business owner.
Join me twice a month for a candid, behind-the-scenes look at what it’s really like working as a wedding photographer – where I’ll give you actionable steps to take your business to the next level. Absolutely no fluff here, friends! So grab your favourite notebook and pen, and let’s dive into this week’s episode.
Welcome, friends!! You’re listening to the very first episode of a special series here on Keeping It Candid!
There are so many different types of vendors that come together on a wedding day, and we all have one main goal – helping our clients have the wedding day of their dreams. And yet, for some reason, it’s so common to find vendors acting like they are the only ones who truly care about the couple, and that every other vendor on the team not only doesn’t know what they’re doing, but is also harboring negative, ulterior motives to make sure the other vendors can’t succeed.
Why is that?! Why do we think things like this?!
Let’s pause for a minute and really think about it. Who is benefiting from one vendor preventing another from doing their job? Not the clients, that’s for sure. And definitely not either vendor.
Now listen – I’m not saying shitty things like this never happen. People suck and do questionable things sometimes. But as a whole, the majority of the time it’s wrong to assume that anyone has intentions any different than yours – to serve the couple, to make sure they have an incredible, stress-free wedding day, to have beautiful decor and eat delicious food and dance the night away, and of course – to have all the photos and videos they can to cherish for years to come.
That’s truly what we all want from a wedding day, and when every vendor can come together with that same mentality, with community-based thinking that drives collaboration and supporting one another – that’s when you get a dream-team vibe that will not only make your clients happy, but also make the whole wedding day so much more enjoyable.
And that’s what brought me to creating the Local Vendor Series, a five-part podcast series where I connected with different vendors local to the London, Ontario area that I’ve had a chance to work with over the last few years. We talked about things like why it’s so important to work together to create that ‘dream team’ vibe, how we can support and serve one another, and some of the ‘do’s’ and ‘don’t’s’ we’ve come across during our time in the industry.
First up, my good friend Dave, who also deserves a special shout-out for being one of my top podcast listeners. He’s the owner of The Alpha DJ Company and is widely known and respected as one of the top wedding and event DJ’s in the London, Ontario area. He began DJing in 2001 and has put in the work to get to where he is now, DJing some of the biggest events in the city and growing his business to now include a team of more than 15 people.
This interview was the perfect way to kick this series off, so let’s dive in, shall we?
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Sandra: Thanks so much for joining me, it’s going to be really weird talking to you and like such a formal setting.
Dave: I was feeling the same way, like, are we supposed to pretend that we aren’t actual friends? Are supposed to like just act like we’re network fellow professionals?
Sandra:(laughs) Awesome. Alright, well tell me a little bit about yourself – who you are, or where you come from…
Dave: I would love to, I would love to. Thank you for having me. My name is Dave in real life, or my business is The Alpha DJ Company. I am more commonly known as DJ Alpha in the wedding industry. I’ve been DJing for about, oh gosh, 20 years now, and I have a wife, who most of the time loves me very much, and two amazing boys.
Sandra: Yes, we love Amanda, and the boys. You get third place in that, but that’s just the rules. That’s how it happens.
Dave: Yeah. I love finding out secondhand, like, things that my wife has sent to you guys to use as collateral against me!
Sandra: It’s one of the reasons, one of the many reasons, why we love her so much!
Dave: (laughs) She’s up for anybody who, like, non-stop harasses me!
Sandra: It’s the best!
Alright, so, I wanted to put together this podcast where I talk to different wedding vendors in the industry, to kind of broach the subject more of like putting together a dream team of wedding vendors and getting rid of the idea that everybody needs to compete for the same space because our end goal at the end of the day, is all to be serving the same couple, and the same clients, and there’s no one, as far as I know anyway, that’s showing up on the wedding day, that’s just there for themselves and no other purpose and like, wants to screw other vendors over to make their lives more difficult or anything like that. So I wanted to know, what has your experience been like working with wedding vendors – er, wedding vendors, (I meant) wedding photographers, in the past?
Dave: I’m happy to say that most of my experience with wedding photographers has been really good. Most photographers are quite easy to work with, quite flexible, happy to do a bit of give-and-take in terms of making sure that the outcome of the wedding a successful. So most of them, I would say, are definitely here for the right reasons. And it really makes a difference on my end too, because obviously, you know, worrying about making sure the couple is having the best day of their lives should be everybody’s top priority. And, you know, worrying that some vendor isn’t going to do the thing they’re supposed to do or might prevent you from doing the thing you’re supposed to do… Like, that should not have had any time spent on it at all.
Sandra: Ya, I totally agree. So when it comes to, like, events during the reception and things like that, do you have a lot of interaction with photographers and kind of, like, making sure that things are running on schedule and things like that? How much do you like to kind of get input and feedback from the other vendors on the wedding day?
Dave: Ya I think that’s a great question, in terms of kind of what is expected from me. And I guess, kind of maybe what I expect from other vendors, specifically from photographers. I do try to keep the lines of communication is open as possible. Mostly because I respect that certain things that they do are very time-sensitive whereas most of the things in my role are not time sensitive. So if you’re going to do anything from, you know, those late-night sparkler shots, to maybe even firework shots, to sunset shots… Those are all things that, like, it really matters that they’re very close to the time that they’re supposed to be at, whereas for me, you know, whether we have the first dance at 8:00pm or 9:00pm, it doesn’t actually change the first dance at all. So my timeline’s a whole lot more flexible than theirs. So I try to be as open and transparent as I can with them and also find that I’m often kind of on the side, you know, one of the proponents of saying like ‘let’s get this timeline back where it’s supposed to be’ – as we know most weddings kind of lean towards running a little late, so anytime I can help to move things along – even 5 minutes, I find, can sometimes can make a pretty big difference in the world of photography. I try to keep it, you know, it’s as close to the timeline is can possibly happen.
Sandra: That’s one of the, like, my favourite thing about working with your team and with other DJs that have the same kind of idea is that, like, I don’t want to take the couple and disappear for sunset photos and then have the DJ go to start the first dance and can’t find anybody. Like, I think it’s so important to have that open line of communication throughout the whole wedding day regardless of what your actual job is for the next few hours.
Dave: I couldn’t agree more.
Sandra: I’m so do you have any like “please do” or “please don’t” scenarios that you can think of from previous interactions with photographers – speaking of like people making a couple disappear on expectedly and things like that!
Dave: Yes, yes, absolutely, I’m glad you brought that up. Actually, let’s start with that “please don’t” ‘cause you just mentioned it. So, obviously, from our perspective, you know, wherever, and whenever you need to take a couple, like, that’s something that you two agreed to, and probably agreed to with the venue. So it’s like, you know, far be it from us in the DJ role to try to overstep there and say, ‘oh you shouldn’t do this.’
I would ask, as a humble request, if, for example, if there is a way that we can arrange the timeline that, as such, so that once we start the party that we don’t then take out the couples, that we don’t take out the heart of the party and go off to do, you know, 30-40 minutes of pictures outside or with family or whatever. Again, this is in a perfect world it wouldn’t happen like that, only in the way that you know, once we lose our couple from the dance floor, everything becomes a lot harder for our, from our perspective, for our jobs and you know, usually if they don’t see a bride or groom or someone who just got married out on the dance floor, they seem a lot less inclined to want to spend time out there unless the drinks have really been flowing for the past couple hours. So, yeah, in a perfect world I’d love to make sure that didn’t happen.
But in terms of “please do,” amazingly, the bar is super, super low. Obviously, you know, please let us know what it is that we can do to help you out. Again, from a selfish perspective, we would love absolutely love if you maybe include us when you send out the albums to them, if you – if that’s something that is permitted, depending on your agreement with the couple. We would love – because we love to see the pictures! But also, you know, we’d love to see if we made the album at all. We use those pictures for everything. We use them, obviously, for marketing and promotion. That’s a huge purpose of them, but we also use them for training. For example, I just shared an album with our team last week, where we had about a dozen pictures of our DJ in the background. And one of the things that we teach our DJ’s is, you know, make sure at all times that you’re actively listening. So you’re never just back there scrolling on your phone or kind of, you know, dead-faced, looking at your laptop, especially during speeches. And this was the example, is we had about 12 pictures where our DJ was in the background reacting to the speeches. So you know, looking sad at times where it was a little bit sadder, laughing along with the guests at the wedding. All things that, you know, you’re- you’re literally in the background of the people speaking, and so there’s 200 people who can see your reaction to the speech. So act like you want to be there and be part of this.
But I can’t believe how many times… Like, I’ll even have a photographer take pictures of me, or of DJs on our team and, you know they’re going to be great shots ‘cause it’s like you with, you know, a full dance floor, maybe like a cool angle of you and, you know they’re great and they exist somewhere in the universe, but they don’t exist in my inbox, that’s for sure. And I’ve even, same with videographers, I’ve reached out after the wedding and I feel like there’s some unwritten rule that I just haven’t learned yet. But I can tell you, for every 99 photographers who say like “oh I’ll send these to you!” – they even take my phone number or email – one of them actually comes through and delivers on it. It’s unbelievable and I’m not sure why – there’s a culture that exists that I do not understand.
Sandra: Oh, that’s so true. I hear that from a lot of different vendors too. I know for, like, myself, sometimes I just forget but yeah, it’s definitely… In the, like, photography community there are definitely mixed vibes when it comes to giving photos to other vendors. I personally think that it’s a great way to network and make connections and build those dream team vendor relationships, but there’s definitely people who don’t feel that way. I think that goes across the board!
Dave: It’s so wild. Like why even take the picture though? If you’re like, if you’re like, this is not how I choose to network with other vendors. Like why act like you do, right?
Sandra: Yeah. Oh absolutely. I totally agree with that! So, I’m glad that you brought up the topic of getting photos. When it comes to DJ’s specifically, like, we can’t necessarily perfectly capture what it is that you’re doing. Like, we can take those, hopefully, images of a packed dance floor and things like that, but from the photos that you have received are there ways that you think that have worked better than others, when it comes to capturing what a DJ is fully bringing to a wedding day?
Dave: You know, honestly, I’m not sure that there is. I’m not sure there’s a great answer to that to say like ‘here’s an album of, whatever, 10 pictures and now, after you’ve seen this album you know exactly what to expect from this DJ.’ I think, like, if anything, you could maybe give some indications of what, you know, in terms of like, how does this DJ dress? What does DJ look like? What does their equipment look like? You know, how does a dance floor react to the things they do? I think you could answer those questions but yeah, to say, like, here’s 100% of what you can expect if you hire this DJ because of these 10 photos, I don’t think so. And also, if I can just add, I also, like, this is… I wholeheartedly respect that no photographer has ever gone to a wedding for a client in been like “here, I’m going to, after I get all these couple photos, like part of my job is to get pictures of your job. Like I know that it’s not and in fact, like even if you took pictures of people dancing and everything like I know that those are going in the album. That’s the point of those pictures. I’m just saying that if I ever, since I was asked! I’d love to also be able to have those pictures. And like, please watermark the hell out of them because that actually save me from going in and finding, ‘oh ya, where did this photo come from six summers ago?’
Sandra: Absolutely. Ya, I totally agree with that. I know if I were not the one behind the camera, I would want to find a way to make the transaction of exchanging photos mutually beneficial and things like that and not just make it seem like, you know, everybody is looking for the photographers to do more work. Like the work is already being done. There’s a way that it can, it can be, we can share the wealth. That’s for sure. That’s my opinion!
Dave: I think, too, like, in the world of photography is like you guys probably don’t think much of, you know, I guess I should say like, the frequency of pictures that you give or take, because this is your life. All you, all you do is talk in pictures. Whereas like, even if you’re like “oh you know, I captured a picture of the caterer just as they were getting ready to serve the meal”, which is like, you just happened to get that picture. Like that caterer probably has about five pictures. Like, even if they’ve been doing it for 30 years, they probably have five pictures of them about to serve their meal because like, who’s ever taking that picture? So, like, to that caterer, I feel like that’s such a valuable thing that they will hang on to forever, whereas I get it, like, in your world, you’re like, this might even be a throwaway photo, like, the couple probably doesn’t want this photo, right? So I get it, I get it. It’s a totally different perspective.
Sandra: Ya absolutely. But like you said, when we’re going through those photos, it might not be something that the couple is like, super excited about, but that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s a throwaway photo. There’s definitely ways that you can get the most out of the work that you’re already doing.
Dave: And I think like, I mean, even that example is like, who knows? Maybe the catering was actually the thing they loved the most about their wedding. And if they had a photo of the person who made that happen, it’s like, sure, they’re probably not going to print it out and frame it but like, I still think they value it. I still think they would show people.
Sandra: Oh, a hundred percent. Now that you say that, I’m like – wait a second, I wish there was a photo of the guy from my wedding, ‘cause we had like –
Dave: Right? Like, if you loved your food, it’d be kind of cool.
Sandra: We loved our food and a friend of mine, like, worked with the company that owned our reception venue, and so they pulled some strings and had a special chef come in and like, he was super nice.
Dave: Oh ya, like, I feel like that’s a perfect example. Yeah. And how often does like cool stuff like that happen? Like, when it does I feel like, you know, capturing it is, is – it would be a great idea.
Sandra: Ya, absolutely. We were looking forward to the food from our wedding above anything else (laughs)
Dave: Amazing! Amazing. I feel like a lot of people do. They put in their top three at least!
Sandra: Right? It’s so true. Alright, so into the last question – what impact does it have on you as a DJ on the wedding day when all the vendors that you’re working with are coming together as a dream team and not fighting for the space and just working together really well throughout the day?
Dave: I mean, thankfully, most of the vendors that I work with are very easy to get along with. That being said, I never really thought about that question at all before you asked it, and I guess, I realize that, you know, I always try to show up, you know, my best self and put forward my best work. But there’s definitely a notable difference in the air of vendors if you have a table of vendors, sitting together having a genuinely great time over dinner.
If you are working together out at, you know, a hot and sweaty ceremony but you’re you’re happy to be working with the people that you’re working with. But I think there’s also kind of, I don’t know if it’s a confidence or a self-assurance to be like, ‘hey, you know, I’m going to work today with Sandra, or a wedding planner or videographer, whoever it is that I just absolutely adore, and not only am I going to have a great time, we’re going to, we’re going to probably have some laughs, we’re going to enjoy ourselves, but I also know that like if I slip up or Sandra slips up, that like, this isn’t going to make headline news, right? Like we’ve got each other’s back. I’m going to make sure, you know, Sandra is, you know, whatever the case is – like, aw there’s no outlets around – well, she knows that I have some outlets under my table, she can charge batteries back there. And we also know that, you know, if I forgot some tape to tape down to my wires, like, you know, a good wedding planner is gonna have my back and they’re not going to be showy about either, and act like they saved the wedding. And to me, that – there’s a real value in kind of that assurance of knowing on your way there, like, ‘do I have everything? Yes, I’m sure I have everything but just in case I don’t there’s other people here who are going to help me out’.
And those are just like the obvious examples. Never mind the, I mean, you know, I’m trying to think of like real-life things have happened to me. Like, I’ve had photographers who have been out, just trying – they haven’t captured that shot yet that they really have been working towards. And so you know I’ll go back and tell the venue coordinator like ‘they’re on their way, they’ll be here in two minutes’ knowing full well they won’t be, but just be trying to buy a little bit of time because this is like, somebody who would have my back too, right. And, and I think there’s there’s a lot of confidence and assurance that comes from that, to say like, no matter what happens today, I’ve got a small group of people who are going to have my back.
Sandra: Yeah, that’s so true. I love that answer.
Dave: I genuinely, I’d say, like, even thinking about driving to the wedding, like it makes a difference on your drive there, waking up that morning to be like, all right, I’m working with this All-Star lineup of vendors today.
Sandra: I totally agree and it’s nice, too – you and I have talked about this, how a couple sometimes are surprised when they know that we know each other, that we have a friendship outside of like, you know, we’ve met, we’ve worked together before – we’re friends, we hang out. They are very surprised by this fact. And so, I think the more that like, vendors are able to make those relationships, it really has such a benefit to the couple as well.
Dave: I couldn’t agree more, I think, ya, they think maybe we exist in silos or that we- we don’t ever want to work with each other. I think people seek out the vendors that they think are similar to them and that they like and trust and kind of form whatever, whether it’s a work friendship or a real friendship, or whatever it is. But I definitely think there’s a value to that and I think too that it offers, albeit a little biased, of a, of an opinion of somebody’s asking for a recommendation or referral. I think it also gives you the opportunity to stay like, listen. I- I know Dave as a DJ and, even being honest, to be like straight after learning about you too I don’t actually think he’s the right DJ for you. If that’s the case, which like, honestly I really appreciate it, right? Because like, thanks for the referral but this couple, like, our energies don’t match at all, right? Or inversely, to say like, ‘listen, you’re not looking for any DJs – Dave is the only DJ that is going to be at your wedding and I’m going to text him right now to tell him to hold the date.’ You know, those kinds of things, ‘cause I think genuinely, like, it’s it’s easy for other vendors to kind of sit in a position be like, ‘you know who’s the perfect, whatever, officiant or caterer for this person’ it’s like, I know because I’ve met them all and I know he’s perfect for you. I think there’s a real value there, assuming that you have that trust that that couple you know, truly believes that you were – you put their best interest first.
Sandra: Ya absolutely. Alright – well, to wrap things up if you can let us know, where can we find you online?!
Dave: Oh, for sure. Everything is ‘The Alpha DJ Company’. So Instagram – @thealphadjcompany, Facebook, of course you can look it up on Google, or our website is just alphadj.ca.
Sandra: Amazing. Well, thank you so much again for being here. I absolutely loved this conversation. For everybody who’s listening – make sure you go and give Dave a follow. If you pop onto the show notes, you’ll find some links there to make everything super easy for you. And if you’re local to the London area, make sure you check out some of the events that Dave is a part of during the year. You can usually check him out at Rock the park and other things like that you will definitely not be disappointed.
That was such a fun interview! Just like most things, podcasting is just more fun when your friends are a part of it!
I mentioned at the beginning of the episode that this is just day one of a five-part series here on Keeping It Candid – new episodes are coming your way every day this week! If you’re ready to start cultivating genuine relationships with the vendors in your area to make next year’s wedding season the most fun, stress-free season you’ve had yet – you don’t want to miss an episode so make sure you check back to listen to the rest!
Before I jump off – if you’re listening to this week’s episodes in real time – you know it’s Black Friday week! Make sure you head over to my Instagram – @simplysandrayvonne – because I’m going to be acting like your personal shopper all week long, sharing my favourite items, apps, services, and more that I use to run my business – including things like website templates and contracts!
If you caught last week’s episode of Keeping It Candid where I chatted with Paige Griffith from the Legal Paige, she mentioned that her entire contract shop is on sale for 40% off this week! The sale officially launched today, and if you pop into the show notes for last week’s or today’s episode, you’re going to find a code to get an extra $10 off during the sale!
Hiring an attorney is expensive and something that’s completely out of the realm of possibility for a lot of wedding photographers. That’s why I LOVE the contracts in Paige’s shop so much and have been using them in my own business for years – they’re easy-to-use, easy-to-understand templates that will help you protect the business you’ve worked so hard to create. I know there are tons of Black Friday sales happening this week, but I promise this one is one that you don’t want to miss!
You’ll find all of the links you need in the show notes, including shortcuts to my favourite Canadian law templates in the TLP shop!
I’ll be back tomorrow with part two of the Local Vendor series, talking with my friend Ally, a wedding planner from Perfectly Designed Events.
Until then!
(Outro Music)
Thanks so much for listening to Keeping It Candid: Wedding Photography Unfiltered with Sandra Henderson! You can find full show notes from today’s episode at simplysandrayvonne.ca/keepingitcandid. In the meantime – let’s connect! You can find me on Instagram @simplysandrayvonne, and on Facebook in the Wedding Photography Unfiltered community! If you’re loving this podcast, I’d be so honoured if you’d go ahead and hit that subscribe button and leave me a review!
Until next time!
Dave Galloway from The Alpha DJ Company
Website | https://www.alphadj.ca/
IG | @thealphadjcompany
Facebook | https://www.facebook.com/thealphadjcompany
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About Dave
Dave’s passion for DJing began in 2001 and he has turned it into a career that he’s proud of. From humble beginnings as an intern at a record store, to bars, nightclubs, and house parties, he took every opportunity possible to perfect his skills. He brings the same approach to all his performances; “do it with passion or not at all”. Every single time someone trusts him to step behind the decks at their event, no matter the size, he feels filled with gratitude and is so thankful to be able to live his dream.
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